Rita Scott (RS) interviews author Seán MacEachaidh (SM) about his book, A Guide to the Silence of the Irish Other World. Thanks to TPQ's transcriber.





The Crypt
Westport Community Radio
WRFM 98.2
Uploaded to YouTube
19 August 2014


RS: You're listening to The Crypt and I would like to welcome my very special guest, Seán MacEachaidh, to the show. Seán is the author of A Guide to the Silence of the Irish Other World. So you're very welcome to the show, Seán.

SM: Thank you very much, Rita. A delight to be here.

RS: Thank you. Well firstly, could you give us a bit of background about yourself, Seán?

SM: A married man, four children, four grandsons, former president of the University of Ulster (student union) and currently an on-call worker – tourism - Heritage Advisor at Carrickfergus Castle and that's about it – for the moment.

RS: Your book is an alternative touring template of Northern Ireland. What can people expect to find within those pages?

 

SM: Right. Well, I would imagine that to me it's about trying to convey the questions or the answers at times - questions that tourists don't ask because they're too polite to ask or when they do ask they get it glossed over. Sometimes it's often the political, the significance of the political, you know, Doire and Londonderry for example. Or you get some tourists who would go to buy a Celtic cross or rosary beads and be told they're not really sold in the area that they're in and they're not told why. I've actually gone - trying to come from behind my eyes and looking out and letting people see a silent tale – that's what I actually believe - on that political front – that's that touring template. But there's a lot more to the silence in the title than I might have inferred there.

RS: Yeah. Well, I have to say when I picked up the book you brought me straight back to my childhood when you're talking about the fire and the hearth in the home and how everyone used to sit around it. Do you think, like myself – what I think is - nowadays this generation is totally missing out on that with all the technology – that's not something you see often anymore.

SM: Ohhh, Rita, straight to the soul of it! Yes. Definitely. One hundred percent. I think that “gut-on-gut” communication or simple just plain interaction – social grace – click, click world - like I had to ask you for help with Skype and I'm actually glad. My children, you know we refuse children, adult children, and thankfully now at the moment grandchildren, but we tell them to keep their mobile phones away from the dinner table because they tell us they can talk to us - hear what's going on - engage in the conversation around the dinner table and still - click,click - Facebook and whatever else and tweet to their friends. We say: No. So yes, they are missing out on the fireside gatherings I think that's very, very important. And as I mention in the book the proverbs and wisdoms that's being passed on from our own people: Níl anon tinteán mar do thinteán féin - definitely one hundred percent! There's no fireside like your own fireside. And it brings back my childhood memories as well.

RS: Now I want to focus on a couple of sections of the book and with the nature of this show of course the first thing I'm going to bring up to you is Halloween. You explained about Halloween now in the book. Now many people mistake Halloween for being an American holiday. So could you tell us the true history behind it?

SM: I would like to think that first of all take it away from the trick-or-treat – yes? The true history? I try to anyway by saying first of all that it is an ancient Irish festival and its roots belongs with us here and why. And certainly I'd like to think I laid claimed to in helping people to get away from this trick-or-treat notion and see it as that veil between our world, the physical world that we're meeting in at the moment or even the virtual world we're speaking in right now and the other world. Most definitely I'd like to think that'll do that, yes. I mean, with me it's the trick-or-treat and the ghouls and the goblins and something or ghosts where frightening things are in the world. To me there's nothing frightening about it. To me it's where that veil that's at it's “thinnest” - and you know you hear people speak of the “thin places” and “thin veils”. I think that Ireland has many portals like that of “thin” places. And to me our dead, for example, have always been buried in, around and amongst us. And thankfully, even to some graveyards, the vast majority of them, people still visit them and it's still a place of reverence and long, long may that continue.

RS: The other section I'd like you to talk about is you wrote about the Big Hunger wrongly being called the Irish famine.

SM: Yes and definitely. And I've always spoke about...I've always told my own children growing up for the sake of a better word we'll use this term of: alternative narrative. But to me even that is denigrating those people that died during that horrible time and it's denigrating the memory of our living memory. Plus those people that now, that I call in the book the exiled children in America that would have been here if their parents hadn't gotten away, especially from places like Mayo, to the far away lands. And to me it's the Great Hunger. Our people refer to it as the Great Hunger - the Big Hunger - just like The Big Wind and other things. It certainly wasn't a God-given thing and yes, I think it's something that historians - some have already re-visited - but I think that the full story - our story – or that alternative missing story - ought to be written into history or as I like to call it: our-story rather than his-story.

Of course, you're speaking to yourself. Where is “her” in her-story? Her-story's not there at all. It's always him. In Ireland, unfortunately, his-story is the victorious male and the victorious male in our story, and I say respectfully, is Britain.

RS: Each chapter's title is in both Irish and English so I take it you're very passionate about the Irish language.

SM: I am indeed. For sure, Rita! I think that the Irish language being used throughout the book - just earlier I had mentioned Irish proverbs - the first thing people think of right away would be the Bible which is the passed on wisdom of, in that case, the Hebrew people and so forth. But all wisdoms, all proverbs are very important. And the Irish proverbs is the passed-on wisdom of our people: Níl anon tinteán mar do thinteán féin. Again: there's no fireside like you own fireside. And I think that even when it comes to the timelines, that the Irish ... and I'm glad that our timelines are still very, very, very rooted in the Irish language no matter how Anglicised - or even like Brian Friel's notion on the translations – you know where a lot has been lost in translation. You know, it's with important names - like in the book – Ballymoney – I mean you'd imagine it would be something along the lines of Baile and achadh but it's not – it's actually Baile Na Móna, and it's “the place of the turf”. So it's the place where people went to to get their turf. People say Baile means “town”.

Well, there were no towns! Until the Normans brought some but the English brought towns to fortify their hold in Ireland and with the towns that's very recent. So it's “the place of the tree” or “the place of the well”. God only knows! A quick one: I was trying to find Ballytobar – of course, it's “the place of the well”. I'd been seeking where is this well? And I kept asking locals in and around this particular area. It's on the Antrim coast. And I asked them where was the well? And nobody knew what I was talking about and they were looking at me in a strange way so I gave up. And I had an American tourist and I was telling her this quest that I'd given up. And I brought her to this old church ruin where Spaniard sailors were meant to be buried and it's a fifteenth century church, Saint Cuthbert, and I had brought her around that to let her see that and see some of the names of the locals there. And the lady pointed out the obvious which was staring me in the face. She said: Would it not be a holy well? And do you know what? She's probably a hundred percent spot on. Whether that's true or not to me that's the importance of the Irish language – the fact that it does give you that inner sense of fantasy. And so in that case most definitely I would argue strongly it roots you to the sense of the place and to the people that once lived there.

RS: And then for people traveling to Northern Ireland what would you say is the most seen spot that would normally appear in your average tour guide book?

SM: Oh, Giant's Causeway – straightaway - Giant's Causeway. It's probably the penultimate. You know, Fionn mac Cumhaill, of course he's - as I've told you in the book there - that Fionn mac Cumhaill built it. And the geologists' argument is that a volcano erupted sixty-five million years ago, etc etc. When you hear both arguments to me the Fionn mac Cumhaill have building it is as likely as in the fifty pier-shaped rocks that appear there – that only appear there - seem to be there - the Island of Staffa. And yet steeped in our myths and mythology you know Staffa comes up time and number. The Antrim coast of course and our end of it comes up. And of course the same Fionn mac Cumhaill is all over Ireland. I mean, our Ulsterman is Cú Chulainn but to me they're rooted with our people. But the Giant's Causeway is probably the top. I think what it will be overtaken by in good time, because of the PR and the thrust, will be the Titanic Museum.

RS: Where can A Guide to the Silence of the Irish Other World be purchased?

SM: It's self-published so it's done through a company called Lulu, so it's www.lulu.com. However, it can be purchased (as) an e-book through Amazon so if it was up to me I think it's a cheaper option. It's actually to me it's the new way, isn't it? So one minute I condemn technology and now I'm actually promoting it a little bit! To me the idea of the e-book was is that it would be there for forever and a day on the internet somewhere. But to me the book wasn't written to be the next Fifty Shades of Grey - although I wish it had have been! To me it was written for my family so it will be passed on to them.

And the fact that I'm speaking to you about it and perhaps another purchase or two - to me it's always a bonus that there's a royalty that comes through and it's not just a bonus it's a...I mean I actually think, I go: I wonder what my Mammy would think? Strange one, isn't it?

RS: Ah! But so true though. And then of course you're on social media as well.

SM: Yes I am. I have a Facebook page where it's probably the makings of a second book if there is ever going to be one. It's for to keep the photographs up of the day and life and what I've been doing - where I've visited – the old stones. And I'm sure there's still many places that even this “author” if you'd like that I haven't discovered yet in the North of Ireland in my particular space. But to me, some of my favourite spots I think that I have to actually point out to you is Droichead na nDeor, which is the Bridge of Tears in Donegal and close to Fulcarragh at Muckish Gap and I think it's exceptional like a “parting place”.

And I'm sure Mayo has it's parting place just like anywhere else in Antrim and that's wherever people departed to far away lands. And these tales are there in every blade of grass and I don't think I'm going to live long enough to know them all nor you nor any of us – but to me – I want to know about them.

RS: Well, that would make it a good page for people to go to as well because you've put up pictures and everything.

SM: Yes, I do.

RS: Thanks so much for taking the time to come on the show today.

SM: Not a problem. Listen, it's a total pleasure. And Céad Mile Fáilte! - that of course as well. Thank you and to anyone listening as well. (ends)

The Crypt Explores the Other World

Rita Scott (RS) interviews author Seán MacEachaidh (SM) about his book, A Guide to the Silence of the Irish Other World. Thanks to TPQ's transcriber.





The Crypt
Westport Community Radio
WRFM 98.2
Uploaded to YouTube
19 August 2014


RS: You're listening to The Crypt and I would like to welcome my very special guest, Seán MacEachaidh, to the show. Seán is the author of A Guide to the Silence of the Irish Other World. So you're very welcome to the show, Seán.

SM: Thank you very much, Rita. A delight to be here.

RS: Thank you. Well firstly, could you give us a bit of background about yourself, Seán?

SM: A married man, four children, four grandsons, former president of the University of Ulster (student union) and currently an on-call worker – tourism - Heritage Advisor at Carrickfergus Castle and that's about it – for the moment.

RS: Your book is an alternative touring template of Northern Ireland. What can people expect to find within those pages?

 

SM: Right. Well, I would imagine that to me it's about trying to convey the questions or the answers at times - questions that tourists don't ask because they're too polite to ask or when they do ask they get it glossed over. Sometimes it's often the political, the significance of the political, you know, Doire and Londonderry for example. Or you get some tourists who would go to buy a Celtic cross or rosary beads and be told they're not really sold in the area that they're in and they're not told why. I've actually gone - trying to come from behind my eyes and looking out and letting people see a silent tale – that's what I actually believe - on that political front – that's that touring template. But there's a lot more to the silence in the title than I might have inferred there.

RS: Yeah. Well, I have to say when I picked up the book you brought me straight back to my childhood when you're talking about the fire and the hearth in the home and how everyone used to sit around it. Do you think, like myself – what I think is - nowadays this generation is totally missing out on that with all the technology – that's not something you see often anymore.

SM: Ohhh, Rita, straight to the soul of it! Yes. Definitely. One hundred percent. I think that “gut-on-gut” communication or simple just plain interaction – social grace – click, click world - like I had to ask you for help with Skype and I'm actually glad. My children, you know we refuse children, adult children, and thankfully now at the moment grandchildren, but we tell them to keep their mobile phones away from the dinner table because they tell us they can talk to us - hear what's going on - engage in the conversation around the dinner table and still - click,click - Facebook and whatever else and tweet to their friends. We say: No. So yes, they are missing out on the fireside gatherings I think that's very, very important. And as I mention in the book the proverbs and wisdoms that's being passed on from our own people: Níl anon tinteán mar do thinteán féin - definitely one hundred percent! There's no fireside like your own fireside. And it brings back my childhood memories as well.

RS: Now I want to focus on a couple of sections of the book and with the nature of this show of course the first thing I'm going to bring up to you is Halloween. You explained about Halloween now in the book. Now many people mistake Halloween for being an American holiday. So could you tell us the true history behind it?

SM: I would like to think that first of all take it away from the trick-or-treat – yes? The true history? I try to anyway by saying first of all that it is an ancient Irish festival and its roots belongs with us here and why. And certainly I'd like to think I laid claimed to in helping people to get away from this trick-or-treat notion and see it as that veil between our world, the physical world that we're meeting in at the moment or even the virtual world we're speaking in right now and the other world. Most definitely I'd like to think that'll do that, yes. I mean, with me it's the trick-or-treat and the ghouls and the goblins and something or ghosts where frightening things are in the world. To me there's nothing frightening about it. To me it's where that veil that's at it's “thinnest” - and you know you hear people speak of the “thin places” and “thin veils”. I think that Ireland has many portals like that of “thin” places. And to me our dead, for example, have always been buried in, around and amongst us. And thankfully, even to some graveyards, the vast majority of them, people still visit them and it's still a place of reverence and long, long may that continue.

RS: The other section I'd like you to talk about is you wrote about the Big Hunger wrongly being called the Irish famine.

SM: Yes and definitely. And I've always spoke about...I've always told my own children growing up for the sake of a better word we'll use this term of: alternative narrative. But to me even that is denigrating those people that died during that horrible time and it's denigrating the memory of our living memory. Plus those people that now, that I call in the book the exiled children in America that would have been here if their parents hadn't gotten away, especially from places like Mayo, to the far away lands. And to me it's the Great Hunger. Our people refer to it as the Great Hunger - the Big Hunger - just like The Big Wind and other things. It certainly wasn't a God-given thing and yes, I think it's something that historians - some have already re-visited - but I think that the full story - our story – or that alternative missing story - ought to be written into history or as I like to call it: our-story rather than his-story.

Of course, you're speaking to yourself. Where is “her” in her-story? Her-story's not there at all. It's always him. In Ireland, unfortunately, his-story is the victorious male and the victorious male in our story, and I say respectfully, is Britain.

RS: Each chapter's title is in both Irish and English so I take it you're very passionate about the Irish language.

SM: I am indeed. For sure, Rita! I think that the Irish language being used throughout the book - just earlier I had mentioned Irish proverbs - the first thing people think of right away would be the Bible which is the passed on wisdom of, in that case, the Hebrew people and so forth. But all wisdoms, all proverbs are very important. And the Irish proverbs is the passed-on wisdom of our people: Níl anon tinteán mar do thinteán féin. Again: there's no fireside like you own fireside. And I think that even when it comes to the timelines, that the Irish ... and I'm glad that our timelines are still very, very, very rooted in the Irish language no matter how Anglicised - or even like Brian Friel's notion on the translations – you know where a lot has been lost in translation. You know, it's with important names - like in the book – Ballymoney – I mean you'd imagine it would be something along the lines of Baile and achadh but it's not – it's actually Baile Na Móna, and it's “the place of the turf”. So it's the place where people went to to get their turf. People say Baile means “town”.

Well, there were no towns! Until the Normans brought some but the English brought towns to fortify their hold in Ireland and with the towns that's very recent. So it's “the place of the tree” or “the place of the well”. God only knows! A quick one: I was trying to find Ballytobar – of course, it's “the place of the well”. I'd been seeking where is this well? And I kept asking locals in and around this particular area. It's on the Antrim coast. And I asked them where was the well? And nobody knew what I was talking about and they were looking at me in a strange way so I gave up. And I had an American tourist and I was telling her this quest that I'd given up. And I brought her to this old church ruin where Spaniard sailors were meant to be buried and it's a fifteenth century church, Saint Cuthbert, and I had brought her around that to let her see that and see some of the names of the locals there. And the lady pointed out the obvious which was staring me in the face. She said: Would it not be a holy well? And do you know what? She's probably a hundred percent spot on. Whether that's true or not to me that's the importance of the Irish language – the fact that it does give you that inner sense of fantasy. And so in that case most definitely I would argue strongly it roots you to the sense of the place and to the people that once lived there.

RS: And then for people traveling to Northern Ireland what would you say is the most seen spot that would normally appear in your average tour guide book?

SM: Oh, Giant's Causeway – straightaway - Giant's Causeway. It's probably the penultimate. You know, Fionn mac Cumhaill, of course he's - as I've told you in the book there - that Fionn mac Cumhaill built it. And the geologists' argument is that a volcano erupted sixty-five million years ago, etc etc. When you hear both arguments to me the Fionn mac Cumhaill have building it is as likely as in the fifty pier-shaped rocks that appear there – that only appear there - seem to be there - the Island of Staffa. And yet steeped in our myths and mythology you know Staffa comes up time and number. The Antrim coast of course and our end of it comes up. And of course the same Fionn mac Cumhaill is all over Ireland. I mean, our Ulsterman is Cú Chulainn but to me they're rooted with our people. But the Giant's Causeway is probably the top. I think what it will be overtaken by in good time, because of the PR and the thrust, will be the Titanic Museum.

RS: Where can A Guide to the Silence of the Irish Other World be purchased?

SM: It's self-published so it's done through a company called Lulu, so it's www.lulu.com. However, it can be purchased (as) an e-book through Amazon so if it was up to me I think it's a cheaper option. It's actually to me it's the new way, isn't it? So one minute I condemn technology and now I'm actually promoting it a little bit! To me the idea of the e-book was is that it would be there for forever and a day on the internet somewhere. But to me the book wasn't written to be the next Fifty Shades of Grey - although I wish it had have been! To me it was written for my family so it will be passed on to them.

And the fact that I'm speaking to you about it and perhaps another purchase or two - to me it's always a bonus that there's a royalty that comes through and it's not just a bonus it's a...I mean I actually think, I go: I wonder what my Mammy would think? Strange one, isn't it?

RS: Ah! But so true though. And then of course you're on social media as well.

SM: Yes I am. I have a Facebook page where it's probably the makings of a second book if there is ever going to be one. It's for to keep the photographs up of the day and life and what I've been doing - where I've visited – the old stones. And I'm sure there's still many places that even this “author” if you'd like that I haven't discovered yet in the North of Ireland in my particular space. But to me, some of my favourite spots I think that I have to actually point out to you is Droichead na nDeor, which is the Bridge of Tears in Donegal and close to Fulcarragh at Muckish Gap and I think it's exceptional like a “parting place”.

And I'm sure Mayo has it's parting place just like anywhere else in Antrim and that's wherever people departed to far away lands. And these tales are there in every blade of grass and I don't think I'm going to live long enough to know them all nor you nor any of us – but to me – I want to know about them.

RS: Well, that would make it a good page for people to go to as well because you've put up pictures and everything.

SM: Yes, I do.

RS: Thanks so much for taking the time to come on the show today.

SM: Not a problem. Listen, it's a total pleasure. And Céad Mile Fáilte! - that of course as well. Thank you and to anyone listening as well. (ends)

2 comments:

  1. I am so pleased that Sean's work is getting this coverage. Have the book and reviewed it for TPQ

    ReplyDelete
  2. I sent Sean's piece from the crypt to a friend living in Malta (she has a love for all things Irish to the extent she's learning Irish in Malta of all places)..

    Anyhow she sent me a youtube poem it's worth a listen. Becasue this part struck a chord with her..

    Yeah. Well, I have to say when I picked up the book you brought me straight back to my childhood when you're talking about the fire and the hearth in the home and how everyone used to sit around it. Do you think, like myself – what I think is - nowadays this generation is totally missing out on that with all the technology – that's not something you see often anymore.

    I'm for one glad I knew life before the interent...

    ReplyDelete