ANTHONY MCINTYRE

ANTHONY MCINTYRE

Monday, April 21, 2014

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Arrest Adams now for McConville murder says republican ex-prisoner


Arrest Adams now for McConville murder says ex-republican prisoner
Suzanne Breen
Sunday Life
20 April 2014

A former republican prisoner says the PSNI should immediately arrest Gerry Adams over Jean McConville's murder.

The ex-internee from West Belfast is furious that in recent weeks police have arrested "a string of low level republicans" whom she believes played no part in the mother of ten's brutal death.

Evelyn Gilroy from the Lower Falls was a member of the republican movement along with Gerry Adams in the early 1970s. She was active in Divis where Jean McConville was abducted.

Last month, veteran republican Ivor Bell was charged with aiding and abetting the murder. Detectives have this month questioned five women and a man about the killing.

In an exclusive interview with Sunday Life, Evelyn Gilroy said: "I'm speaking out for the first time because I'm very angry that grassroots republicans are being arrested.

"Police have lifted people who were 15 and 16 at the time of the killing, yet Gerry Adams remains untouched. I'm disgusted that ordinary republicans are being put through the mill for his actions.

"It defies belief that he hasn't been arrested. The police should stop chasing those who were never in a position in the republican movement to order Jean McConville's execution and instead arrest the only person who was in that position – Gerry Adams.

"He has got away with so much over the years. He now seems to be getting away with this as well. It will be a disgrace if ordinary people end up carrying the can for what he did."

The Sinn Féin president has told his solicitor to contact police to see if he is wanted for questioning over the murder. He said if the PSNI wish to talk to him, he will meet them.

Last month, Jean McConville's daughter Helen told Sunday Life she wants to see the Louth TD in the dock for her mother's murder

Mr Adams was OC (officer commanding) of the IRA's Belfast Brigade when Jean McConville was murdered in December 1972. He denies all involvement in her death and secret burial.

At one meeting, he told her family he was in jail when she disappeared – which wasn't true – and he offered to help them in their search for the truth.

Ms Gilroy said: "I don't know how Gerry Adams had the nerve to look the McConvilles in the eye. If he wants to know the truth about Jean's execution, all he has to do is stand in front of the mirror and talk to himself."

In an interview with Boston College, former Belfast Brigade commander, Brendan Hughes, said Mr Adams had ordered the widowed mother's execution.

Mr Adams said: "Brendan is telling lies. I'd no act or part to play in the abduction, killing, or burial of Jean McConville." He denied similar accusations from Dolours Price.

Ms Gilroy said: "His denials are on a par with his claims that he was never in the IRA. He has become a walking joke. I'm sure he will now call me a liar just like Brendan and Dolours were called liars.

"But anyone active in the republican movement in the 1970s in Belfast knows who the real liar is. Brendan Hughes was an honest man. Even those who hated his politics acknowledge that. When Brendan spoke about Jean McConville, he was telling the truth."

Jean McConville was driven from West Belfast to Co Louth where she was shot in the back of the head in Shelling Beach. Her remains lay undiscovered until 2003.

Ms Gilroy, 61, comes from a strong republican family from the Lower Falls. The authorities viewed her as a significant republican activist in the 1970s and she was arrested dozens of times.

She and her sister, Mary Kennedy, were the only two mothers among the 2,000 people interned by the British government. She was held for 18 months in Armagh jail.

She is a close friend of ex-IRA chief of staff Billy McKee. A few years ago, she was presented with a commemorative plaque by the IRA's old 'D Company'.

At the time of the McConville killing, Ms Gilroy lived in Whitehall Row in Divis Flats, across the way from Jean McConville.

She claims that "many myths" surround her murder. The veteran republican said it was "totally untrue" that the widowed mother was killed for comforting a dying British soldier. She insisted the incident as described never took place.

A soldier had been hurt, but not fatally, in Divis. It was Ms Gilroy's sister, Mary Kennedy, who helped him and not Jean McConville, she said.

"My sister lived five doors from Jean McConville in Farset Walk in the flats. Weeks before Jean was killed, a soldier was hit on the head by a brick thrown by a local lad. My sister heard him crying. She was a very soft, warm woman and she brought him into the hallway and gave him a glass of water.

"Her act of compassion didn't go down well with some. 'Touts Out' and 'Soldier Lover' was painted on her door. The incident was reported to the media. My sister gave an interview to Downtown Radio about her act of mercy and the intimidation that followed."

Ms Gilroy, who was eight-and-a-half months pregnant with her second child when Jean McConville was murdered, said she believed the mother-of-ten was killed because she was an informer, a claim the McConvilles and others deny.

When she was Police Ombudsman Nuala O'Loan dismissed the informer allegations saying her office had extensively examined intelligence available at the time and found no evidence Mrs McConville had ever passed information to the security forces.

But Ms Gilroy said: "It might not be popular to say she was an informer but I firmly believe she was. The IRA found a radio in her flat. That doesn't in any way justify what happened to her. It was a terrible thing for that family.

"I can't get my head around how the IRA would kill a mother with all those wee children. They could easily have ordered her out of the country and put her on a boat to England or Scotland with her kids. She should never have been executed."

Last week two women – aged 57 and 60 – were arrested and taken to Antrim police station for questioning about Jean McConville's murder. The PSNI said they were later released pending a report to the Public Prosecution Service.



Unionist Reaction
By Suzanne Breen
Belfast Telegraph
20 April 2014

Unionist politicians are calling for Gerry Adams to be arrested over Jean McConville's murder following claims from a former republican prisoner that he alone was in a position within the Provisionals to order the mother-of-10's brutal killing.

Evelyn Gilroy, an ex-internee from west Belfast, expressed her anger that six "low-level republicans" had been arrested this month about the 1972 murder while police hadn't even questioned the Sinn Fein president.

"Police have lifted people who were 15 and 16 at the time of the killing, yet Gerry Adams remains untouched," she said.

"The police should stop chasing those who were never in a position in the republican movement to order Jean McConville's execution and instead arrest the only person who was in that position – Gerry Adams."

Ms Gilroy was a member of the republican movement along with Mr Adams in the 1970s. She was active in Divis where Jean McConville was abducted. Mr Adams has always strongly denied any involvement in the horrific abduction and murder of Mrs McConville.

TUV leader Jim Allister said: "With even a former colleague in the republican movement, Evelyn Gilroy, now calling for Gerry Adams to be arrested over Jean McConville's murder, the police's inaction is becoming unsustainable. Continuing to treat Adams as an untouchable, in the face of such exposure, brings policing into disrepute."

Ulster Unionist minister, Danny Kennedy, said: "The increasingly compelling evidence against Gerry Adams cannot be ignored. It is beyond the time that he should be arrested and questioned. The PSNI must act now and it is in the public interest that they do so."

DUP MP Gregory Campbell said: "The comments about Gerry Adams from a republican active at the time of Jean McConville's abduction and murder have credence.

"They are the latest in a series which can't be easily dismissed by Sinn Fein.

"The police should question Gerry Adams as a matter of urgency. If charges are appropriate they should follow irrespective of the fact he is a TD."

Last month, Mr Adams told his solicitor to contact police to see if he is wanted for questioning over the murder. He said he is willing to meet the PSNI.

76 comments:

David Higgins said...

I can't agree with this sentiment. While i understand her frustrations, it's a sad day when republicans are calling on the Brit forces to arrest anybody. I can't think of any scenario where it is justifiable.

frankie said...

it's a sad day when republicans are calling on the Brit forces to arrest anybody.

Mairtin O Muilleoir of Sinn Fein said this concering the murder of Tommy Crossan

"I urge everyone to work with the police to remove them from our streets."

In all likely hood some faction of PFR was behind it and Marityin O'Muilleoir is calling the killers criminals . Does he think the same about giving the PSNI information concerning Jean McConville?

The PSNI have read and watched Voices, they have a partial transcript of the project, inverviews conducted over the last two weeks, HET files...now this..

Maybe Gerry Adams teflon is better than John Gotti's was. But teflon stops protecting after while. Maybe, like grouch said the best way to get Gerry Adams to tell the truth is for Ivor Bell to do what Sammy the Bull did on his one time friend and turn states evidence.

No matter how many times I've read that piece today and from lots of angels, Gerry Adams is on borrowed time. I had never heard of Evelyn Gilroy until this morning. And I bet Gerry is thinking the same, the PSF PR dept must be in over time trying to come up with an excuse to dismiss her. They'll say she is anti-treaty.. But then what? She doesn't come across as having anyway like the health issues that plagued Brendan Hughes or Dolours Price. And she's very much alive and was once part of the 'Dog's....

If Evelyn Gilroys version is true ( thats how its coming across to me) that also means Nuala O'Loan was kept out of the loop...

Max Headroom said...

While i agree with Davids comment it would be an amazing predicament for Sinn Fein to be in if Adams ever did get arrested and charged.

Think about it,...Deputy OC/Banquet Men has stooped so low he probably took his fucking shine box with him into Windsor Palace, and his parties Furher could be spending two years in a British Gaol during the 2016 FF/ FG/ LP/ PSF/ Irish traitors fest in Dublin.

Where would Adams do his time?
Something tells me he'll never be welcome with the folks in Roe House which will leave him with only two other options, either spend it in isolation or with the hoods & perverts as a conforming prisoner.

One last thought, just imagine that Adams never ever gets questioned over the disappeared, it would surly indicate that he also received a PSF/PIRA Royal pardon?

If the whole episode swings in either direction he's fucked and the Shinners must know it, unless of course he gets exonerated and it turns out he really was never in the IRA.

The possibilities are mind blowing....

Mac Tíre said...

She's not anti-treaty. She's anti-republican.

Fionnuala Perry said...

This is a tricky one for all concerned. I for one would not want to see Adams arrested.
Yet it was Adams himself who led the call for information to be handed over to the PSNI in relation to this 'grave injustice'
His actions have been reminiscent of the biblical stance taken by Pontius Pilate. He hastily washed his hands in a very public stance to deflect from himself onto others.

Adams didn't distance himself because he feared breaching an IRA code of honour. He has spent the last thirty years breaching IRA codes.
Adams knew that there would come a time when cans would have to be carried and he was determined he would not be carrying any.

Has Evelyn said anything here that hasn't been said before? No!
The security forces at that time would have been acutely aware who was who.
Adams has repeatedly called for his party and the public to pass on information.
Is passing on information now part of another ' big picture'
'We'll call on people to inform but the rest keep your mouth shut' it doesn't work like that it gets too confusing. 'Tell or not to tell' ?

They've done their fair share of squealing themselves.
Their ranks are full of the dubious and the proven but no one cares.
Leaking stories, fabrication and double dealing, behaviour so unscrupulous, the average person wouldn't contemplate, but they do. No dirty trick is considered too dirty.

Gerry should know betrayal runs very deep and sometimes the measure you give is sadly the one you end up getting.

Max Headroom said...

Franike

The statement from Sinn Fein is predictable and nothing new. The NO.1 rule in the Sinn Fein State Operators Manual is tout like fuck as long as it doesn't involve Sinn Fein.

The point that David and I were making is that those who claim to be Republicans should be ashamed of giving information to the Crown prosecuting services, Sinn Fein don't have that concern because they are the Crown prosecuting services.

tiarna said...

Evelyn Gilroy said: "I'm speaking out for the first time...

Frankie Said: "If Evelyn Gilroys version is true ( thats how its coming across to me)..."

I would question Evelyn Gilroy's motives? Is she breaking cover and merely repeating publicly that what she has said on the Boston Tapes? (on presumption that she was a contributor). We have seen this sort of resentment reaction before with Gerry McGeough who said that if he was to be arrested for past actions then so too should Gerry Adams.

There has been much debate about the credibility or not of the Boston Project and those in position who gave assurances. But the contributors, it is said, gave their accounts in confidence and on a condition of death disclosure --Is Gilroy coming forward as a state witness against Adams?

Gilroy and mcGeough's point are not entirely invalid ones (and neither are the SF ones) but if it is a name and expose game between the collective two main factions of Republicanism we can expect another violent Prison Segregation Campaign.

sparky heels said...

divide and conquer i fecking hate youse english and what youse have done to former comrades up the dogs just sad

sparky heels said...

mac tire just remembered what an ole comrade and a good bloke he is too, said to me she was protesting and condeming the the IRA many moons ago,and never mind they have done their fair share of squealing i think if they were here today they would regret getting people lifted a thing they never did when they were living hurt people sine e move on feck the lot of youse..

billy brooks said...

Tiarna..Could you explain more about the violent battle you forsee in the jails.Surly if gerry was jailed h wouldnt expect to walk onto a republican wing after him telling people to tout on the very people in there.Would he become a blanket man if hes isolated.there be no trouble tiarna.hel just have to double up with liam.

Fionnuala Perry said...

Sparky Heels.
If you go back and read what I said properly I was talking about the squealers who swell up the ranks of Sinn Fein.
Scap would still be sitting in A/Town if the FRU hadn't outed him.
And of course f you too!

larry hughes said...

mac tire

remove 'republican' from the issue (you have removed it from everything else.)You are in an outfit constantly calling for people to give information, support and cooperation to the RUC/PSNI.

However on the issue of a disappeared mother of ten kids, you are angered that someone whom the dogs in the street can smell the stench off in relation to that 'crime' should face the same standards in relation to law and order.

You people are surfing a tsunami of lies, hypocrisy and bull-shite. I suspect when the time arrives that an effective republican alternative emerges to your phoney populism, you will all vanish back under the wee opportunist rocks you crawled out from under. Leaving Gerry, Marty, Story and Kelly old men with fuck all behind them except their own arse-holes.

If Gerry were convicted he could share a cell with Liam for the two years, those two 'understand' each other, tiz a family thing.

sparky heels said...

I was angry Mrs Perry lmao and full of rum so apoligies to you ,nowt personal,its caused so much division amongst good people,i had my fair share of working with touts like many other good people just glad im here to think bout the feckers unlike others..

Mac Tíre said...

The day Sinn Féin name and then call for the arrest, detention or investigation of an individual in connection with any militant actions against British forces or their informers,is the day I walk away.

This, however, seems a practice exclusive to anti-Sinn Féin republicans.

tiarna said...

billy brooks

If we collectively lump all factions together we can visualize two main factions of republicanism --and the finger pointing and name game will not stop at only Gerry Adams --so I envisage potential for opposing republicans ending up in Jail and none too happy with each other --that they would be asking their jailers to keep them separate.

And on the issue of touts, while every dissident might not be directly a tout the dissidents are controlled by the Brits and serve their interests more than the people they claim to be serve. A collective of Republican intelligentsia have been writing articles in local papers trying to get through to dissidents with no success. There has been no articulated or cogent response from dissidents --probably because their handlers are stumped for one. Brit money buys deaf ears and is obviously hard to walk away from.

Fionnuala Perry said...

Sparky Heels,
It's not Mrs it's Ms Perry but your apology is accepted.

I know at least four dubious and two known informers in quite relevant positions in Sinn Fein.

This party are openly calling people informers, yet as I pointed out they were happy to let Scap sit where he was until Ingram outed him.

You can be anything as long as you wear a Sinn Fein badge, gangster, squealer , slum landlord.


Boyne Rover said...

I can’t believe it we have another MichaelHenry, Mac Tire what a stupid statement you have just made, do you not watch TV or read newspapers
Both your party leader and your administer of all things British have both stated that anyone with any information should pass it on to the PSNI, and your administrator of all things British called on everyone with information on republican activity to immediately run to their nearest RUC sorry PSNI interrogation centre and give them as much information as possible, oh and yeah I think he called them TRAITORS

Max Headroom said...

Mac Tíre said...

"The day Sinn Féin name and then call for the arrest, detention or investigation of an individual in connection with any militant actions against British forces or their informers,is the day I walk away."

Sinn Fein are wise enough not to have named anyone publicly but that in no way reflects what's really going on behind the scenes. How do you think McGuinness got to play a unionist's bitch in Stormont shining shoes? or being invited to dine with his boss? the answer to that is through touting and showing his commitment to destroying the Republican Movement.

Sinn Fein have already publicly called for the arrest, detention and investigations into individuals in connection with militant actions against British forces numerous of times on television and other media outlets providing those investigations are unrelated to Sinn Fein party members. Sinn Fein clearly want their cake and eat it and it shows just how perverse and far removed they are from republican thinking.

If Sinn Fein had their way they would have us all shaking hands and dining the monarchy so that it would take the bad look off themselves. Mick Collins also believed in the same futile strategy in that it would be a stepping stone to a united Ireland and a century later we're still no closer.


"Don't go my friends, we will lead you to the republic"

That's a far cry from the dining table a Windsor Palace where we're at now.

Mac Tíre save whatever republican morals and principles you still have left in you and get out now before it's too late, you're clearly not an idiot but you are being taken for a ride on the train of corruption.

larry hughes said...

Fionnuala

'You can be anything as long as you wear a Sinn Fein badge, gangster, squealer , slum landlord'.

NO KIDDING. Personality disorder party they truly are. Roy 'of the rovers' McShane has just been outed as the latest 'tout' in a party of self confessed RUC supporters and seekers of information against those nationalists opposed to their pro-British agenda. I read the link I've pasted below and to me the two biggest and "DEFINITE TOUTS" are in the photo. How can these guys go through the ritual and motions? The window dressing and acting in a throw-back as if a super-grass had just emerged in the 1980s. The worst McShane could possibly be accused of doing is ADHERING to SF party policy. So what is this crap all about?

Mac Tire
TAKE A SERIOUS REDNER .. for a very long time!!

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1578125/Gerry-Adamss-chauffeur-outed-as-informer.html?fb

Fionnuala Perry said...

Larry,
Mc Shane was going in and out of the Sinn Fein centre after the talk had started.
One big melting pot or what? Lol

The Brits must have been as confused as everyone else.
Roy was in security as was Mc Carthy, Scap, John Joe and Davidson.

Where else would you have got it? Is it any wonder Brendan flipped when he released the ubiquitous nature of treachery.
What has leaked out this far is merely the tip of an iceberg.
Adams knew what Davidson was when he presented his brother with an IRA medal.

If a person presented this as comedy, people would boo the act off stage too far fetched!!

Then, they call other people touts. Belfast security was rife with touts and those who survived the Brits exposure now sit quite comfortable and quite safe in well paid community posts.

Mac Tíre said...

People like Donaldson and McShane were former members of Sinn Fein but they were also former members of the IRA. If their past involvement with the former besmirches the general standing of Sinn Fein then does their involvement in the latter tarnish the legacy of the IRA and all former members? I don't think so! No right thinking person would sully the name of all involved based on the nefarious activities of a few.

Who has ever been arrested or investigated on the evidence of a Shinner? I urge everyone of you to look into this and present the evidence or alternatively accept that no such person exists. If any of you feel that you want to convert me then it is quite simple, bring me the name of one person in jail on sinn fein evidence and I will walk away from Sinn Féin!

Boyne Rover said...

Would advising people to give information about Republican activity to the British Security services by a member of Sinn Fein DFM Martin Mc Guiness be good enough you .Mac Tire

Tain Bo said...

Tiarna,

it is amusing to say the least how unglued republicanism is as we follow supposition and presupposition where republicanism works on the bases of adding by subtraction multiply with division.

I assume from reading the article that a rather baser motive of frustration comes to the fore.
Now we are faced with the dilemma of position whether we adopt the moral high or low ground.
I don’t agree with any republican being lifted so it becomes a conundrum though that seemingly only applies to the higher echelons’ within the broken tradition of republicanism.
Which is made clear in the article?

“Police have lifted people who were 15 and 16 at the time of the killing, yet Gerry Adams remains untouched? I'm disgusted that ordinary republicans are being put through the mill for his actions.”

The word “tout” is bandied about regardless of fact or consequence.
The question is should people feel loyal to the militant tradition and adhere to self censorship to protect the former leaders of that tradition which runs contrary to the position Sinn Fein have adopted in support of the PSNI and civil law and order.

With the recent shameful visit to their Queen that was a severe blow to the traditional republican psyche under the premise of reconciliation and cooperation demonstrating that at least Sinn Fein is accepting of British rule.
It would be difficult to argue in the neo republican world whether any “code” of honour has been broken.

Sinn Fein appears to be caught in their own snare as they ask republicans to politely pass on information to the PSNI about other republicans.
Its problematic inform on traditional republicans but adhere to the code of silence in regards to neo republicans

This storm in a teacup has been brewing for a right while Adams being confidently on record is willing to cooperate with the PSNI would that not fall under breaking the code or is breaking the code only reserved for the lesser?
I would assume touting and willing cooperation are one of the same standard.

Then again that rule in Adams case would be vague as he denies personal involvement in the IRA respectfully the claims made against him may also be vague as they are not directed at a member of the IRA technically the claims would be against a member of the RM.

It would be arguable if the militant code was broke.

Personally, I would look at the greater picture Adams is essential in the stability of neo republicanism I wouldn’t show any confidence in the British removing a vital lynchpin in the mechanism of controlled peace
That is unless they have no further use for him and decide to feed him to the lions as Marty is showing signs of social climbing perhaps ambitions of becoming number one.

Whilst I disagree with much of Sinn Fein’s policy I can’t argue against their right to speak of it, it is the truth as they see it.
Whilst I hold the view against any republican being persecuted I think we overlook the true victim in this charade “Jean McConville” and the mental anguish and continuing suffering her family are forced to endure.

Before we adopt the high ground I would consider the brutality and the bitterly cold treatment inflicted upon this woman callously executed though that was not enough the added humiliation of secretly dissipatedly dumping her lifeless body in a secret grave does not ring of honour and no code should protect those who decided disappearing people advanced republicanism.

Whilst we show concern over Gerry Adams we do republicanism no favour by ignoring horrific unnecessary grievous mistakes made.
Though not all blame lands on the republican doorstep the RUC were just as callous and had no concern or interest in the disappearance of a single mother.

Today the same is applied as it is not about solving the murder but about political showmanship where the people most affected have the least right and absolutely no power.

If there are republicans out there who believe this practice was honourable then please explain to me why a code should protect those who sanctioned the disappeared.

Fionnuala Perry said...

Mac Tire
Are you for real?
Dennis Donaldson was a fully fledged agent when he was head of Sinn Fein on Stormont.
How many went to gaol on his word? In thirty five years how many do you suspect?
Same with Mc Shane, Scap and all the others squealing from the 70s.
If your not an idiot your doing a good impression of one.
Why do you think they went into Castlereagh?
'Bring you a name' you could stick your hands into the wounds and you would still disbelieve!

No one is interested whether you stay in Sinn Fein or not but as Grouch said you are becoming Mac Tiresome .

Mac Tíre said...

Fionnuala,
You are right,I didn't make myself clear. What I should have said was;

Who has ever been arrested or investigated on the evidence of a Shinner who wasn't subsequently dismissed from the party with ignimony for their treachery?

You see, Sinn Féin don't laud such people or their shameful behaviour, and we don't seek to excuse it. I wish I could say the same about others!

Fionnuala Perry said...

Mac Tire,
There are touts sitting in senior community positions via Sinn Fein.
Some started life in security but ended up in Sinn Fein and then senior postings in different forums.
They knew Mc Shane was a tout and they let him take part in an IRA guard of honour.
I know more about Sinn Fein and who is amongst their ranks than you would ever know.

Mac Tíre said...

Fionnuala,
Like everything else you spout on here, it is never backed up with any evidence. I would ask you to name and shame the so called touts, but I wouldn't want to be party to one of your crazy witch hunts that may put the lives of innocent people at risk.

You say you know more than me about Sinn Fein rank and file. Well that wouldn't be too hard. I like to keep myself to myself. That being said the Sinn Fein landscape has changed in recent times, there are a lot of young folk coming up, the ranks are swelling and momentum is building. I reckon that despite what you think you know, you know jack shit!

Max Headroom said...

Mac Tíre

No one here really gives a flying fuck whether you stay in PSF or not, you obviously have a blind obedience to a party which is clearly corrupt & perverse.

You seem to believe in the myth that Sinn Fein still harbour the old IRA code of honour in regards to all things ‘treachery’.
So, if you are not aware already allow me to enlighten you with the news that certain Sinn Fein members are legally armed by the British Northern Ireland State with personal protection firearms sanctioned by the spooks in Whitehall & the Chief Constable of the PSNI.
It is also a fact that these weapons are being carried by Sinn Fein neo gunmen during their appearances at republican parades & commemorations and at the gravesides of republican patriot dead throughout the north with the British government backing should they need to use them in the event of your Stormont Banquet Man ever being attacked by non conforming republicans. These neo Shinner gunmen have also received anti-terrorist close quarter protection training by the PSNI/British government.

What was that you were saying again about treachery?

Looks like you're in the wrong party mate.

Victory to the Banquet Men!
God Save the Queen!

the watcher said...

Fionnuala please excuse my ignorance and as you will find out I will ask more questions than give answers as I continue my very sad and lonely quest to understand modern day Republicanism from all sides. I have a query about your statement "Adams knew what Davidson was when he presented his brother with an IRA medal." Was this Gerry Adams presenting Davidsons brother with an IRA medal or was it Davidson presenting Gerry Adams brother with a medal? If it was the former why would a non member be given the honor of presenting medals surely an ex OC or similar should bestow this honor on ex combatants?

frankie said...

The Watcher,

My understanding is Brendan 'Ruby' Davidson was alledged to have supplied intell. that led directly to the killing on the rock. And Gerry Adams hououred him (Brendan Davidson) after his death and after he (BD) was outted as an informer..

Fionnuala Perry said...

Mac Tire,
I don't spout, unlike you I walked the walk .
If you were so sure of yourself and your Republican credentials you would write under your own name.
You know nothing other than what you are told and it is becoming increasing evident.
I know more about Sinn Fein that you'll ever know! Is that what needled you? Because your now up against people who know more than you and your so called Republican connection?
Think Sean and Grouch are right. Time for you to go away you know.

frankie said...

Isn't Evelyn Gilroy saying "Back up people and refresh your memories".. She gave an interview to Downtown radio at the time giving a completely different version of events than what the history books claim.


"My sister lived five doors from Jean McConville in Farset Walk in the flats. Weeks before Jean was killed, a soldier was hit on the head by a brick thrown by a local lad. My sister heard him crying. She was a very soft, warm woman and she brought him into the hallway and gave him a glass of water.

"Her act of compassion didn't go down well with some. 'Touts Out' and 'Soldier Lover' was painted on her door. The incident was reported to the media. My sister gave an interview to Downtown Radio about her act of mercy and the intimidation that followed."


I'm sure it would be possible to ask Downtown radio to search their archives and ask them to reproduced the interview..

What we all know is if the the same allegations were made about you, me or anyone else the PSNI would have knocked on doors asking questions long before now. I personally think they are making a water tight case and some day soon they'll throw the book at Gerry Adams.

The PSNI have said the case against Ivor bell wont be fast tracked. My guess is the whole thing will blow up sometime around the elections next year...

larry hughes said...

Mac Tir

Gerry and the RUC knew what Liam was doing since the 1980s. Gerry protected, relocated and promoted Liam without even a whiff of interest from the RUC or Brit media to undermine him. (You try standing in an election with even a rumour in your closet!!)Then when the girl went looking for justice and Gerry and the RUC were left embarrassed Gerry gave evidence in Liam's court case and he is now doing 16 years. Not content with that, Gerry dumped his dead daddy into the family paedo septic tank too. After he had given him an IRA funeral of course. I think you'll find Gerry is still in SF.

Then there's Scap. You are concerned with convictions resulting from touts. How do you think the alleged touts felt on their way to S. Armagh when their handlers failed to intervene to save them from execution and how do you think they'd feel if they'd known the man torturing then before their execution was a tout also?

Dirty organisation led by a dirty rat is my estimation. But 'water finds it's own level' they say, so maybe you're in the right company.

If SF members are carrying legally held guns for their own protection then it just reinforces my conviction(pun intended)that they are fully aware of the treachery they are engaged in.

Guilty by association. SF members cannot claim to be ignorant of ALL the goings on. Careerists at any price. The most obvious requirement for membership other than self interest is self-delusion.

billy brooks said...

Mac Tiresome..Thought you were out doing a bit of ruling by fooling are you telling the people your asking to vote that your party has agreed welfare cuts after the election.Can you be happy telling the decent people who have come through so much lies.The party is based on lies.

Mac Tíre said...

If one more person tells me to go away....I'm going to get an inflated opinion of myself! It took yous longer than this to shaft MH! I must be doing something right!

The truth hurts but I'm going to stick around and keep on telling it like it is!

The watcher you said,

"I continue my very sad and lonely quest to understand modern day Republicanism from all sides."

There's no need for it to be either sad or lonely. I reckon that to understand the present you need to have a fundamental understanding of the past. Go back to the roots of republicanism and emerse yourself in it, then track it right up to present day. Assuming you haven't done this already of course.

One point worth thinking about on your quest is that the troubles was known as the dirty war. The IRA had to match the brits with a ferociousness akin to the one the brits were used to dishing out....likeways nowadays Sinn Fein are compelled to match the brits in terms of their cunning! The war has never been dirtier, the only thing that has changed is the arena in which it is being fought! Will the ends justify the means? If Sinn Féin deliver a united Ireland at the cost of shaking hands with Liz Windsor and reaching out to unionists (and a wider electorate *cough cough*) then will it be justified? This is my opinion on it but don't take my word for it.

There are a plethora of books and documentaries that can help you but I suggest you also go to all the public meetings held by the different groups where they will each set out their stalls. This is the easiest way to seperate the wheat from the chaff.

Happy hunting!

eddie said...

Frankie,

How could any body have done an interview with Downtown radio at the time, - Downtown did not come into existence until 1976?

Fionnuala Perry said...

Mac Tire,
You don't know the truth how could you? Your just bleating out propaganda.
Sean was spot on when he said , answering you is giving you credence.

You have been given a lot of tolerance on this site.
I went on Beechmount Sinn Fein Cumann about ' the fisherman' and they pulled the whole thread.
Large doses of truth appears to put them on edge or maybe like yourself they don't have a clue.
No matter what you say to your little Shinner friends, you can never say Mackers and other people on this site did not accord you the right to speak.
Personally I think answering you is a waste of effort. In time you'll drift and spread your dreary logic elsewhere!

frankie said...

Eddie,

I stand corrected...

She said she gave an interview to Downtown radio and gave them a completely different version of events.

And I also said...

I'm sure it would be possible to ask Downtown radio to search their archives and ask them to reproduced the interview..

All anyone has to do is ask Evelyn when her sister spoke to the radio station and backtrack.

The PIRA said for years Maurice Gilvary. was an informer.. And after another internal investigation they held their hands up and said they shot the wrong man. it wont bring Maurice back but they admitted they fcuked up. And as unpalatable it is for lots of people, I believe former provisionals when they say Jean McConville was an informer. That doesn't excuse her disappearance. I don't buy into the line she (Jean McConville) was shot because she helped a wounded British solider. I just don't buy into that school of thought..

frankie said...

I'm going to get an inflated opinion of myself! It took yous longer than this to shaft MH! I must be doing something right!
Mac,

I thought you had an over inflated ego already and Cllr McIvor down fall was of his own making and no one else's..

Mac Tíre said...

Well Fionnuala you and others could always ignore me! See how long that lasts. lol. The reality is that I'm just too charming to ignore! And I'll keep on pointing out your bullshit unhindered!

Alternatively If you and others really want me to leave I will go on two conditions! :)

1) You all (anyone who has exchanged with me previously) indulge me, and take part in a short game I have invented. It shouldn't last more than 10 minutes and even Tain bo should be able to follow along.

2) Once I leave, no one forces me back onto this site by having a go at me!

If you all want to be left alone to spew your hatred and nonsense unchallenged then play the game.

frankie said...

Once I leave, no one forces me back onto this site


Mac, I personally couldn't care if you stood on your head, drank a glass of water while reciting the alphabet backwards

DaithiD said...

indulge me, and take part in a short game I have invented.

Haha I thought people only spoke like that in movies. Ones with improbable dialogue.

Max Headroom said...

Mac Tíre said...

"If you all want to be left alone to spew your hatred and nonsense unchallenged then play the game."



Would that be the same devious game that Sinn Fein are currently playing with voters?

Or the one your party leaders played with the lives of volunteers?

You seem to have learned the trade of dodging questions very well but i suppose that's expected whenever Master Artful Dodger is leading your party.



Frankie

Nice one and my favorite band of all time.

ps: I still can't get my head round posting links on here, it doesn't seem to work for me, obviously doing something wrong somewhere.

Tain Bo said...

Mac Zebedee,
Considering the Quill functioned long before you popped out of your SF box I doubt your absence would garnish any commiseration unlike the likeable rogue Mickey Henry you have not endeared yourself here.

I would assume there are many sites where you can play games on or perhaps you have one of those wee video game consoles where you play “Call off Duty” or “Assassins Creed”
Since you admit you are only here to arse about and play childish games I would think you have earned your own page entitled Zebedee’s Game page.

Sound advice Zebedee I will ignore you not under your conditions but I already have my own arsehole which you astoundingly mimic and have the excretion function down to a fine art.

I think if we reenacted a biblical scene the crowd would chant for Mickey Henry go play with the not so great Sanhedrin and spread the book of excuse and denial according to the gospel of Sinn Fein.

Zebedee, Mickey was a nuisance you are a complete pompous pretentious bore.

Mac Tíre said...

No takers then?

frankie said...

Max,
All I can do is try and explain it again (maybe more clearer) about how to link using HTLM

Copy & paste everything in the 'letterbox' that is between the tags (basically the red bits) onto a word document or other. Then delete everything within the quotation marks <--don't delete them

(http://www.echoecho.com/htmllinks01.htm<---that part you delete)

and copy/paste whatever URL you are linking to and where it say's 'here', delete that and put in the text you want. Then copy/paste the whole lot into your text...

Mac Tíre said...

By the way Frankie that is such a tune! Should I stay or should I go now! The sex pistols best song since blitzrieg bop!

Tain Bo said...


Max,

if you are having a problem with HTML linking go to YouTube and type in creating a link in HTML the visual might help with all that mumbo jumbo computer jargon.

the watcher said...

Well Mac Tire just a couple of points, firstly it was the Ramones not the Sex Pistols who recorded Blitzrieg Bop, my era unfortuunately. Secondly I may confuse people by stating my lack of knowledge of the direction in which the RM seems to be moving,I am and always was an avid reader of all literature (I especially like Michael McLaverty)including modern Irish History. I was born and educated in West Belfast, come from a Republican background and still have friends in and outside Sinn Fein. I decided to immigrate after the ceasefire purely for financial reasons but venture home very frequently when I catch up with friends from both sides of the Republican coin so to speak. I just choose to listen to both sides to form an opinion before talking. What I can't fathom nor stomach is Republicans turning on each other so rabidly, there must be a reason. Whether I agree with some of the regular bloggers on here or not I would never disrespect their efforts in what as you quite correctly described as a dirty war nor would I dismiss their opinions. On the other hand the same rules apply for the PSF side of the debate as I previously stated I was and still am friends with members. I come on this and other sites to avoid becoming institutionalised into any particular stream of thought. As long as any statements or opinions can be backed up or verified then they should be listened to. Name calling and sniping from either side is really uncalled for it achieves nothing except polarising people.To plagiarise Martin Luther King I have a dream that Republicans can reunite no matter what differences under one banner to unite the people of the 32 counties and become 1 nation. As my grandfather used to tell me,and he served 10 years 'in 800 years in various wars the british never defeated Republicanism, Republicans defeated Republicanism' I pray this isn't the case again. Maybe I live in a little Utopia but I believe where there is debate, discussion and multi rather than unilateral thinking we can move forward.
Sorry for the long winded reply but I'm kind of new to this type of discussion. And thanks Frankie for clarifying a question I had, the waters are very muddied from where I paddle.

Mac Tíre said...

I know the sex pistols didn't record blitzrig pop and sure they didn't record "should i stay or should i go" either. I was messing about...maybe I was a bit too obvious for frankie!

Incidently Brian Keenan shared your vision. There is a video on youtube of him calling for republicans to reunite. Brian has been called all sorts by some of the people on this site. I'd love to link it on here but i have no clue how frankie does it. Check it out peeples!

larry hughes said...

mac tire

hang on in there. Fionnuala isn't as bad as her 'bark'. Sure where else would ye get such craic?

Mac Tíre said...

Well if I learn nothing else on this site maybe I will learn how to link videos and articles using html.

Here goes nothing. If this works then I dedicate the link to Frankie. You'll have to excuse my choice of video, but trying to find something that can't be construed as offensive by you bunch is harder than you'd imagine.

Monkey

Fionnuala Perry said...

Larry,
Wish he would hang out with his cronies on the Cumann websites. One voice says all .

Max Headroom said...

This one's dedicated to Royal Sinn Fein

frankie said...

Max,

Let me be one of the first to congratulate you on posting links.

Mac Tíre said...

Frankie it's a C at the end of Mac not an X!

Thanks anyway, I couldn't have done it without you!

Max Headroom said...

Cheers Frankie & Tain Bo

The shinners wont know what hit them from here on in.

The cheek of this cunt

Mac Tíre said...

Well Max has been a Quiller for a million years and more,
Of bullshit and innuendo, he thought he knew the score,
but now he has a weapon that he never used before,
The Shinners are looking worried, and they're going to worry more!

Max's new skill, sing up the Quill
Oh ah up the Quill, oh ah up the Quill!
HTML Linking in the skyyyyyy!!!!!!

frankie said...

Mac,
Up until this week you hadn't a clue how to post a link. So stop trying to be little people. And you are lucky I don't have the same info available to me as TPQ does. I'd geo locate you and then simply sit back and launch what is called a 'man in the middle attack' and read everything that goes through your network, then I'd fuck up your HDD and block you from posting (not by your IP/ISP..I'd block your mac address mac..).

Max Headroom said...

Mac Tíre

The link wasn't a fuck up it was deliberately switched/pulled to the main topic page, same thing happened to another link i posted in reply to you on a different page, i know this because i double checked the links before postings them, luckily for you and Sinn Fein it seems someone doesn't want me posting links.

History and the passage of time will confirm to the present believers that your party are the most corrupt, devious, treacherous,hypocritical,perverse party in the history of Irish nationalist politics and asking anyone to vote Provisional Sinn Fein is akin to asking people to support the spread of a disease throughout Ireland. Face up to the facts and stop pulling the wool over peoples eyes, Sinn Fein are no longer a republican party and they're certainly not socialists either.

How can anyone claim to be Irish republican whenever they are packing UK sanctioned firearms for their protection against Irish republicans?

Tain Bo said...

Max,

ta, but I only suggested the visual as I know the mumbo jumbo computer language can melt the mind.
I think it was Frankie who started the linking here on the posters end which is handy rather than pasting a URL (Uniform resource locator.) Saves time and gets a point across.

Tain Bo said...

Frankie,

I assume since he had to copy you on the linking I doubt he would know his media access control address.
Why waste your time he admits he is here to wind people up and in general be the token SF arsehole destined for the sewer here.

Mac Tíre said...

Max,

I didn't say it was a fuck up, I believe Frankie hinted at it though when he accused me of trying to belittle you. I was just mocking you for your assertion that "The shinners wont know what hit them from here on in!" OH NO!!! THEY CAN LINK YOUTUBE VIDEOS USING HTML!!! MY DAYS HERE ARE NUMBERED!

You said,
"The link wasn't a fuck up it was deliberately switched/pulled to the main topic page, same thing happened to another link i posted in reply to you on a different page, i know this because i double checked the links before postings them, luckily for you and Sinn Fein it seems someone doesn't want me posting links."

Are you accusing Anthony of censoring you/blocking your links? I for one call bullshit on this!

Frankie,
Save me the Die Hard 4 routine you clown. Here's an idea, why don't you geo-locate my middle finger, it's the one sticking up and pointing in your direction! You don't even know what a 'man in the middle' attack is for christ sake! OK you can link a few bits and pieces using HTML, don't be running out and starting up a new "Anonymous" with Tain bo just yet. Tain would be a great asset by the way, he knows what URL and MAC stands for!

Max Headroom said...

"Are you accusing Anthony of censoring you/blocking your links? I for one call bullshit on this!"


I'm not accusing Anthony of anything but the fact remains that the links which i submitted in my posts were not the links which appeared, both my links worked perfectly well under their original URLs and somewhere between me submitting them and them appearing they got changed. For me to make the error which appeared would have entailed me cutting and pasting the address at the top of this page into my link which i didn't do.

frankie said...

mac,
Give me a laugh. What makes you think I don't know about man in the middle attacks, I suppose I don't know how to use tools such as wireshark either, I can't clone sites using 'set' for example. I don't have a virtual machine with three other OS's running...I don't know how to DDOS, crack wifi passwords and a host of other things in between..

As for 'Anonymous, Lutz' or who ever.. I do what is known as ethical hacking. You should really get out more instead of watching Bruce movies. I suppose I can't pay the guitar either...

AM said...

Max,

Blogger does not provide the facility for us to edit comments or have any input into the content of the comment. We can block a comment in full or alternatively delete it. The commenter can also delete their own comment.

If you posted a link and it is under your user name then it is a problem at your end not here. If we need to edit a comment for any reason it is then posted under the user name 'AM' and would state in bold for example from Max Headroom. It is a DIY editing facility but it makes it very clear who has done the editing.

As that has not happened it seems you have made an error somewhere along the line or there is a glitch or misleading link of some sort.

Why not post your link again and post the URL beneath it so that readers can find what it is you want them to see for themsleves?

frankie said...

mac,
Follow this piece from TPQ last year and you'll find a small interchange between my goodself and a poster called Maitiu...(if you can't be arsed reading for the post's to find out what Isaid , it went someting like this...)

Maitiu, Did you learn/cover any pentesting in your degree? Or have you ever 'dabbled' in it?

@ Frankie, Network security is a large part of my studies. I have been known to " dabble " in my younger years. Let's say, I am a huge supporter of Anonymous and peoples right to information. Besides, if the vast majority of people knew exactly how easy it is to gain access to their home networks and even national industries. They would never send any personal info via TCP/IP. Ever. I always advise family and friends to sit their network behind an encrypted VPN. AES Blowfish 128bit is all that is required.

Maitiu, My jury is out on Anonymous. Thats down to certain people not hacking ethically..I agree with Snowden, Manning etc, but the people who DDOS because they can. They piss the 32A"s of me. I'm 100% with you Maitiu, most people don't know how vunerable they are. With out a great deal of know how, most if not all posters could learn how to 'piggy back' their neighbour, do a basic 'man in the middle'...whatever before midnight tonight.

i could easily re-post other comments i've made before Sept 2013 concerning the same subjects and not only from this site. Tell me again I don't know about various forms of attacks that are possible, networking and whatever in between.

People like you mac epitomise why Republicans stopped listening to PSF. You are full of hot air. You originally said here a few weeks ago you wont insult Republicans who came through the conflict but all you have done is try to poke fun at not only Republicans but almost everyone else who see through PSF's lies. You are what is known in the trade mac as nothing more or less than a 'keyboard warrior' plain and simple. And I'm taking other peoples advice and i'm simply going to ignore your post's, even if they are directed at myself. They (your comments) will go out my left ear as quick as they enter my right...

Max Headroom said...

Cheers Anthony thanks for taking the time to explain how things operate here. Initially I thought there was a middle man (spook) somewhere intercepting posts which is sill a distinct possibility but as you said a cyber glitch is also a distinct possibility.


This was the link I initially posted.(also below)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ch5u8YbOyIE

Which is in stark contrast to this

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/7934894.stm

The other link which got corrupted on the other page was this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yLmd0100T9g

Which was in response to what Mac Tíre said...

Vote Sinn Féin on 22nd May - join Sinn Féin today!


Frankie what's the best way to link images?

AM said...

Max,

a strange one. Maybe Frankie can explain as he seems to understand something about the way these things work. I simply don't know.

frankie said...

Max,
There are a few way's to copy images Jpegs, Gifs, etc.... they are more or less the same. But basically it's like this...

With Firefox, you simply 'right click' on the image and it will say on the menu 'copy image location' click onto that..and copy/paste into the 'href' tags as you have done.

With Opera basically the same, 'right click' on to the image and it'll say 'copy image address' same as, just click it and copy/paste.

With Chrome you simply 'right click' on the image and select 'copy link address' same as copy/paste the link/address into the 'href' tags.

With IE it's a bit different. Right click on to the image and a menu opens up,scroll down to 'properties' and click that another window opens. Where it say's 'Address/URL' right click, then press 'select all & ok' close the windows and copy/paste the address into the 'href' tags.

(max, if you have a problem get back. Sometimes when you right click and it wont say 'copy image location or copy image address etc..but it will say something close to 'view image', click on to that and it's as above)

frankie said...

max,

The part about IE..after you press 'select all' , I forgot to say you need to copy then press 'ok'..

Sorry for the mistake..

Max Headroom said...

Thanks Frankie for you long reply.
It seems my latest links are going round in cycles again so i'm gonna try and get them right before moving onto images.

Trying something different here with this test

Henry JoY said...

Adams arrested.
To go to Irish Times article click here

frankie said...

I know who killed my mother, says Jean McConville's son

sean laig said...

thanks Frankie, that was a good interview with Michael McConville. The free staters on RTE's late late show tried to use his sister a few years ago to back their own position but for whatever reason she froze and her interview didn't come across well. -

sean laig said...

the amount of families traumatized and broken by the British "security" forces no doubt dwarf that of the McConville's and like cases but such is the political set up that the McConville case is front and center in public attention and will continue to be for quite a while. All the cards are with the Brits, but what harm the whole scenario is doing to the community and the island as a whole. Gerry Adams was talking yesterday about his rights as a leader but it's obvious that he's nothing more than a gombeen whose whole take on top down republicanism is in and of itself suspect. Obviously "truth and reconciliation" in real terms didn't get much light in West Belfast and only get mentioned when it's of personel political benefit to the SF brass. If the McConville children had been treated with a modicum of respect would this present farce have been played out. The spotlight should be on British atrocities, and even the clandestine role of the British in this case instead of groveling, self aggrandizing, and insincerity by PSF.