Wednesday, January 23, 2013

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It Was a War Crime

Sandy Boyer (SB) interviews via telephone Bernadette Devlin-McAliskey (BDM) about next week's Bloody Sunday March in Doire.

Radio Free Éireann
WBAI 99.5 FM Pacifica Radio
New York City
19 January 2013


SB:  We're going over to County Tyrone, Coalisland, Co. Tyrone to speak to Bernadette Devlin-McAliskey.  Bernadette, thanks very much for being with us.  

BDM:  Hi, Sandy.  Thank you.

SB:  And Bernadette, forty-one years ago on January 30th 1972, you were at the civil rights rally in Doire.  You were on the platform when the British paratroops opened fire and killed thirteen people.  And now forty-one years later you're going over to speak at the rally that the relatives are organising.  Tell us a little bit about that.

BDM:  Well I think the history of Bloody Sunday itself is well known and then following that the very, very long battle to try and discover the truth of the government action on that day and to clear the names of the dead from the responsibility placed on them for having been accused of participating in unlawful and violent behaviour and basically causing the event. 

People are also I think familiar that after a very, very long campaign of  over thirty years the British government set up a public enquiry which itself then became very controversial.  An enormous amount of public funds was spent on the enquiry.  Most of it necessitated by the amount of money it required to prise the information out of government and government agents in order to bring it forward to a government financed enquiry.

At the end of the day Lord Saville did report and he exonerated all of the dead from any unlawful or violent behaviour. And he placed the blame for Bloody Sunday on the soldiers on the ground on the day and on one or two of their commanders at a lower level. 

Many people immediately following that were caught up in the euphoria of finally being able to: a)  to be able to get a verdict on the innocent victims ... the thirteen people killed on the day and (b)) to have an assertion – finally, publicly - that the people on that day were exerting their lawful and peaceful right to assemble and to protest against the actions of government.

But from my own perspective, and I think it's important to say that Sandy, from Bloody Sunday itself I was one of the very few people never to call for a government enquiry.  I didn't call for it and I never supported the call for it.  I respected the right of the relatives to do so because I believed that the government at the highest level was implicated in that decision, that it was a war crime and that Britain should have been held to account at The Hague where governments are held to account for crimes of that nature. 

So as the years have gone on it has become increasingly clear - and Saville was limited and couldn't find some of the information (of course, he didn't look) - that would have implicated very high ranking members.  And we've seen now things that we now know that we didn't know then around the Pat Finucane inquiry and the importance and the role played by MI6 and MI5.

A number of the families continue to protest.  The majority of the families have supported a Sinn Féin position that Saville basically draws a line under this. 

But there are many people who still, and I include myself there, who still demand to know what was the role of government because the blame for Bloody Sunday has been basically left by the government on the foot soldiers that they sent in there and the result, as it stands, quite a body of evidence to show complicity of government but it was never examined by Saville.

SB:  Well why is it that have Sinn Féin and some of the relatives have said:  no, let's put a line under this, it's over, we got an apology from David Cameron, let's just move on?

BDM:  Well I think that a number of public enquiries became caught up in that.  You know it's difficult to set it out there because the importance of closure and the importance of answers to victims can't be under-estimated.

But justice is not the sole terrain of victims. The whole of society needs to have justice and needs to have truth.

So while, if you'd like, the verdict of innocence for all of the civilians killed was a great relief to the families and allowed them closure, it became a sort of thing that the families could then in a way, dictate the pace to everybody else. 

And so when the majority of the families were happy with the outcome for their particular family it made it easier for politicians then to avoid the more embarrassing bits that will inevitably come to play - that the political organisation of Sinn Féin, which was the political leader, the single biggest political leader of the struggle and the resistance, is now in government - and through time will find itself to be in government and in administration with a government that has apologised left, right and centre but not for what it actually did and for what, in all reasonableness I'd suppose when you look at it, continues to do.

Because if we look and we come right up to now...just today I saw in the newspaper things that have become commonplace, Sandy.  You look at the newspaper today and you read that the Lord Chief Justice, who now is not a member of the old aristocracy, the old British, the Protestant ascendancy - he's from Saint Malachy's old boys - he's the Catholic intelligensia in government and in high places - and the Chief Justice has put a reporting ban, a public reporting ban, on three re-trials, we don't even know which they are but three re-trials and that's where the court, where convictions have been overturned as unsafe and the people have been sent for retrial - there's going to be no reporting - even as to what the trials are - until they have been adjudicated upon. 

There is now, which is my other reason for going to Bloody Sunday, is there is now less room and less tolerance by those in government, including those in the Assembly and the Executive, for any opposite voice, any voice of opposition, any dissenting, any critical voice to the status quo or to the government line. 

And these are very dangerous times.  And you see the first of it when you see riots in East Belfast.

SB:  Well, speaking of the riots in East Belfast ... in Doire they are erecting flags of the Parachute Regiment, the people who did the killing, in Loyalist areas that can be seen... 

BDM:  Well, of course!  Sectarianism raises its head again and the flags dispute in Belfast has enabled us to see just how fragile and contrived the new dispensation that they speak of actually is.

And I've been saying that for some years; in fact I think for about fifteen.  And when you say that people then say: Do you want to go back to war?  No!

If you speak out loud then, if you voice any critical analysis of what is happening, you are accused of taking people back there.  But it is the pretense that we have a settlement, the pretense that we have a justice, the pretense that we have a future that we do not, that is bit by bit being laid bare and these are very dangerous times.

SB:  Bernadette, speaking of very dangerous times, we have a situation where Marian Price and Martin Corey are in imprisoned indefinitely without a trial and no release date.

BDM:  Yep. 

SB:  There've been protests but nothing has happened.

BDM:  Yep.  There are a number of things and I suppose that may be a longer conversation, Sandy, about how this process has been put together and how the slow realisation, particularly of people within Sinn Féin as an organisation, the very, very slow, fragmented realisation that this is not what they wanted or not what they thought it was, has allowed the fragmentation of that movement in various steps. 

So that when you have things like virtual internment without trial, when you have the deterioration of the rights and conditions of prisoners, when you have the conviction of Brian Shivers overturned - the man refused bail and put on trial again which is what's happening - you have a whole series of things against - as well social and economic austerity, increasing poverty, cuts in the welfare and health systems - you just say why is there no coherent organisation against it?

And it is because, and I said it when the framework documents many years ago were sent out, the British policy here was not peace - it was pacification, demilitarisation, demobilisation and demoralisation.

And the people who are suffering from the political, social and economic ills are so fragmented amongst themselves because each of them pulled out of the process at a different stage and none of them trust each other.

SB:  But Bernadette, if we give Sinn Féin complete credit for everything they say – and they have protested for Marian Price, they have protested for Martin Corey - you'd have to come to the conclusion that they're powerless in this administration.

BDM:  Well, exactly!  And I think that is the position that we have come to.

The British administration have extracted all they can from a compliant parliamentary nationalist position of both the SDLP, which is now a minority position, and Sinn Féin so they have nothing else with which to negotiate. 

And Sinn Féin may have forgotten who their adversaries were but they're very foolish to think that a British Empire much older than their little upstart selves would forget so quickly who Sinn Féin were.

SB:  And now we have these Loyalist protests in Belfast mainly, which have paralysed the city and cost the merchants tens of thousands of pounds and neither the established Unionists nor Sinn Féin nor the SDLP seem to be able to do anything about it.

BDM:  Well, it's interesting to see how that comes.

It's ironic to see Loyalists in the ghettos of East Belfast shouting “PSNIRA”, accusing the police of being supporters of the Republicans when there's no evidence of that.  The police have been afraid to control the demonstrations and therefore, despite the fact that they are unlawful assemblies the legislation around unlawful assembly has not been used and they haven't been dispersed.  They have been allowed to, in an exercise of what is called “peaceful protest”, they have actually been allowed to intimidate the police.

The thing was started by Mike Nesbitt's Unionist Party and Peter Robinson's DUP in an effort to create a crisis that would expose the Alliance Party.  And they were so out of touch with reality because they believe in this contrived peace process that they didn't understand what they were actually doing and they unleashed this on the streets and they can't control it.

It'll be interesting to see how, when the marching season comes around, the police tactics as used today will then be able to be changed in order to control much larger manifestations of marching and flag waving and what we see from that and what we can particularly see in the whole confusion and inarticulate rage of people, which is a very, very small grouping, but it is a reflection of a reality that while it's being portrayed differently, because there's always been much more political oganising on the Nationalist side, you have the leadership of Unionism and Nationalism basically closeted into a sectarian, a management of sectarian divisions, around a peace process - and there's always a management of sectarian interfaces.

And at the top benefiting from it. 

And on both sides you have the people who've gained nothing from the peace:  the poor - the working class Loyalist - the poor - the working class Nationalists.

And sooner or later, Sandy, somebody's going to have to realise that it is the ideology of Unionism and Nationalism that is flawed.  Sooner or later we're going to have to have conversations about class interests and imperialism. 

SB:  Well, we will await that day.

BDM:  We've been waiting a long time, Sandy. (both laugh)

SB:  We have indeed and some of us have been talking about that for a long time especially yourself. And Bernadette, thank you very much.  It's always a pleasure.

BDM:  Thank you, Sandy.  Always good to talk to you.

93 comments :

Belfast Bookworm said...

Great interview but so much there.. Where do you start?

I for one was caught up in the euphoria that day of Savilles report. But when the dust settled and I realised what wasn't acknowledged or apologised for I was gutted and the penny dropped that a deal had been done; we'll give you your inquiry and here's what the outcome will be..but we'll give you no more so let that be the end of it.

I'm glad some of the families seem to have had some degree of closure but those who haven't, for whom Saville wasn't enough, good on them for continuing their fight.

The Finucane family have no doubt learned a great deal from the Saville inquiry - I hope they get justice. With Geraldine Finucane at the helm I think they eventually will - a formidable woman.

Kieran said...

Why do Americans never speak about their own war crimes in Afghanistan, Iraq, Central America and Vietnam ? Stones and glasshouses.

itsjustmacker said...

Belfast Bookworm:

"Great interview but so much there.. Where do you start?"

That is the six million dollar question.
No one wants to go back to war, but, knowing our history of splits and civil war, its in our genes to fight to expel the British from our Island, At the moment that is not possible because to many many groups are sprouting up wanting to be at the forefront. It takes collective agreement, Planning , courage and dedication, and, a sworn oath never to sit in any British establishment,stormont included ,and, this oath can never be voted on to have it rescinded ,like those which SF had changed to suit their own political agenda within that British establishment (stormont).

Yes, I agree, that was a very good interview, and, Bernadette is still going strong, she is a great speaker and sticks to her principles.

AM said...

She is certainly not reluctant to venture into areas where others don't want her to go. Fair play

eddie said...

She is right, Bloody Sunday would be a war crime anywhere else and she is right in saying it was directed from the higher echelons of the Government.

Sinn Fein leadership want human rights issues such as Bloody Sunday to go away. The mirror politics that is the N.Ireland state means that if Nationalists / Republican pursue justice as they have the right and fight within themselves to do, this will result in the SF leadership being similarly targeted for human rights abuses / war crimes.

Therein lies the reason why SF leadership are putting clear blue water between themselves and those groups who are campaigning to have human rights abuses / war crimes brought to light

Fionnuala Perry said...

Bernadette a fearless formidable woman. Long may she run.

marty said...

Its official Big Joe Mc Cann was murdered

itsjustmacker said...

Marty:

Joe was murdered by the brits in the Markets not far from his own house, he was in OIRA.

Dixie said...

Veteran civil rights campaigner Bernadette McAliskey was the main speaker at the rally which followed the march.

Speaking at Free Derry Corner, Ms McAliskey paid tribute to the march organisers.

“It is important to remember to challenge the cover-up, even though some people from time to time begin to tire or begin to collaborate with the state and believe that it should be swept away and a new start made,” she said.

Ms McAliskey also called for the release of prisoners Marian Price and Martin Corey.

“We came on the streets to end internment without trial yet here we are 41 years later in a new administration, a new dispensation, new power structures, and new civic collaborators and we still have internment without trial with people in prison on the whim and diktat of the Northern Ireland Secretary of State,” she said.

http://www.derryjournal.com/news/local/derry-marches-pass-off-peacefully-1-4726915

Dixie said...

Thursday, 20 March 2008

Deputy First Minister Martin McGuinness today confirmed that he felt the most expensive inquiry in British legal history would not have been necessary if Tony Blair's government had apologised about Bloody Sunday.

The Deputy First Minister spoke out after former senior Downing Street advisor, Jonathan Powell, claimed in a new book that Mr Blair regretted setting up the Saville Inquiry.

In Great Hatred, Little Room: Making Peace in Northern Ireland, Mr Powell claimed Mr McGuinness privately admitted that the inquiry was an unnecessary concession when an apology would have sufficed.

Read more: http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/mcguinness-says-saville-inquiry--was-un.htmlssary-13395195.html#ixzz2JOXCbkK9

From A piece from Derry socialist and journalist Eamonn McCann which appeared in the Derry Journal on the 18th of September -

[...] "Which leads me to mention yet again the curious incident in the corridor outside the Guildhall main hall on the day of publication of Saville's report: within minutes of my having read out a statement on the report for the approval by the families, a senior official of the Northern Ireland Office confronted me at about six inches range to say that my remarks were out of order. She explained: 'Everybody was agreed this was to be a day of reconciliation.'

I have on a number of occasions wondered aloud or in print whom she could have meant by "everybody" and how "everybody" could have agreed on a response to a report if nobody had been briefed beforehand on what it would say."

Dixie said...

"Deputy First Minister Martin McGuinness today confirmed that he felt the most expensive inquiry in British legal history would not have been necessary if Tony Blair's government had apologised about Bloody Sunday."

I have on a number of occasions wondered aloud or in print whom she could have meant by "everybody" and how "everybody" could have agreed on a response to a report if nobody had been briefed beforehand on what it would say." - McCann

“It is important to remember to challenge the cover-up, even though some people from time to time begin to tire or begin to collaborate with the state and believe that it should be swept away and a new start made,” - McAliskey

Doubtless there were certain people who had agreed that an apology would be enough to bring about an end to the Bloody Sunday Campaign before the Families had even seen the report...

marty said...

Dixie was it Jonathan Powell who said that a apology would suffice or was it actually q$£ Martybhroy McGuinness I find in so hard to tell the difference,

itsjustmacker said...

Marty:

It was McGuinness who said it.

Robert said...

Dixie,

Have you ever heard of a large residence on the Letterkenny Road called 'Government House'.

Whoever purchased this property recently will, I am reliably informed, have plenty of room in which to store his fishing tackle.

Dixie said...

Robert are you referring to Glendarragh House on the Letterkenny Road? Recently sold I see.

Are you pulling my leg. Not even that brassed-neck fucker could get away with that?

itsjustmacker said...

Robert/Dixie:

The said property was put up for auction, it was advertised in Colraine and Ballycastle offices of Mc Afee Estate Agents,(distant relations on my late fathers side of the family). any further info you want, I can get from the Ballycastle office. But I know who you are implying of the purchaser.

marty said...

Robert has it a swimming pool ,sauna and room for a phoney?

Robert said...

Dixie,

'Are you pulling my leg. Not even that brassed-neck fucker could get away with that?'

I feel an Ed Moloney - Walter Ellis moment coming on - who could you possibly be talking about?

That pretty much reflects my own initial reaction. The information is relayed in good faith and motivated by public interest - satisfy yourself as to it's accuracy.

'Government House' not Glenndarragh is a large two storey listed building with substantial ground. It was recently purchased but even in a depressed property market listed buildings come to market at a premium. How are the 'nouveau riche' financing this type of purchase? A 'brassed - neck fucker',as you factually describe him, would normally hide these type of acquisitions through an intermediary. A daughter for instance.

Belfast Bookworm said...

I've just googled this house, based on the details here, and found it on property pal.

You have got to be feckin kiddin' me!!!

Can I post the link Anthony?

AM said...

go ahead

Belfast Bookworm said...

Belfast Bookworm said...

Belfast Bookworm said...

Apologies - I can't seem to carry the link over?

Anyway, it's on property pal at the address above. It would take the eyes out of your head!!

frankie said...

Is this the house here

Dixie said...

http://www.propertypal.com/glendarragh-house-43-letterkenny-road-derry/148343

Would somebody tell me if this is the house we are talking about?

itsjustmacker said...

Belfast Bookworm:

link is:

Glendarragh Housesold

Belfast Bookworm said...

Yes, that's the one I thought.

Why can't I have this house? I have a job, sometimes have had to work two jobs to make ends meet, live in a two income household, never go out across the door, rarely spend money on clothes or any other such luxuries and have to go the credit union to get a holiday or buy a car so I can work.

Why not me? Are the interest rates in the credit union top high maybe?

marty said...

Just googled on the link Itsjustmackers put up fuck me Robert he must be richer than you a cara,even Coco White wasnt that careful saving his pennies,my first thought was that line from Animal Farm when all the other animals looked through the window they couldnt tell the difference,there is a lot to be said about earning the average industrial wage..

michaelhenry said...

Robert imply's a certain person bought this house then imply's that its his daughters house-i would hate to have a relative who bought a house-what would people think-

marty said...

Well Mickeybhroy if your boossman has bought this house or as Robert has suggested through an intermediary like a daughter then they will be able to explain how they came to be in a position to purchase such a property the cost of the staircase alone would keep you pissed forever,and how do you feel that the higher echelons within your party seem to have a better share of "the average industrial wage"than everyone else within q$£?.AUSTERITY what fucking AUSTERITY?..

larry hughes said...

I love reading Bernadette's speeches. She's really great. But I must confess to having a wry smile at the comment about Unionism unleashing protesters onto the streets and then being unable to control them...Civil Rights in the '60s anyone lol. And again at the talk of imperialism on an American radio station... WTF? Hilarious.

Robert.

Just showed my mrs that house...if marty mi5 has 'hooked' himself that he's feeling well safe at this stage. And with michaelhenry's comment ots easy to see why. dear oh dear oh dear!

Robert said...

Dixie,

As stated in an earlier post it is not Glendarragh House. It is known as 'Government House'. It is included in a DOE register of 'Parks, Gardens and Demesnes Of Special Historic Interest' @ http://www.doeni.gov.uk/niea/registerni-revision-2.pdf.

Robert said...

Michael Henry,

Au contraire Michael - Robert has implied nothing - the inference drawn is all your own.
When you reported all of this speculation on the party hotline to the 'Politburo' what did they say? Let me guess - 'We need to stand shoulder to shoulder, he's trying to face down the institutions.'

marty said...

GOVERNMENT HOUSE ;How fitting!

itsjustmacker said...

Robert:

I downloaded the pdf.

But if you click on this site, it shows, Government house as being on Letterkenny Rd, but whilst still on the same site, Enter Glendarragh house in the search panel to the right of the screen, believe it or not, it shows the exact same house , but places it in Crumlin, now is that food for thought about old Land registers.

Click government house to view

Belfast Bookworm said...

Robert; 'party hotline'!!!

Quip of the month! :-)

itsjustmacker said...

michaelhenry:

"i would hate to have a relative who bought a house-what would people think-"

If it was the house in question ,Would it not be, "Were the hell did they get the money for that"!, rates would be more than triple my mortgage, and the repayments, ASTRONOMICAL to say the least!, ah, they must be Lotto winners and kept it secret.

michaelhenry said...

" Robert has implied nothing "

You impLIED that i was on the party hotline to the Politburo- hardly nothing-

itsjustmacker-

Youse have been on about this house on the Prairie for a couple of days now and yous still dont know which house it is- youse would be some treasure hunters-lol-

AM said...

Robert,

you know them so well

AM said...

Stephen,

which is why they so easily fit the description mimic men

Belfast Bookworm said...

Soooo.,, Michael Henry, there is a house then - just not the one we think it is?

Go'n tell us.

Robert said...

MichaelHenry,

'You impLIED that i was on the party hotline to the Politburo- hardly nothing-'

No, that comment was quite unambiguously put rather than implied in the knowledge of how organisations like Sinn Fein structure themselves. Party hacks such as yourself all gravitating around a cult of personality, desperate for favour.

'Youse have been on about this house on the Prairie for a couple of days now and yous still dont know which house it is-'

I believe I have consistently referred to the one house in question. Is it significant that your only response is silliness rather than denial?



AM said...

Robert,

you know them ever more well than I thought you did last time!! And no one is in any doubt about your integrity on this matter. You have always called it as you saw it

Dixie said...

"The house was built for The Honourable The Irish Society for their General Agent in 1849"

Seems another one could be moving in lol

Robert I think I've tracked down your house now. Most definitely not Housing Executive.

Robert said...

Anthony,

Thanks for that and for the facility to put this information out.
I believe that while people like Michael are happy to surrender what little faculties they possess to charasmatic authority, the rest of us have a right to scrutinize the financial dealings of those who hold public office and particularly those holding office in dubious and controversial circumstances. Would you be surprised if the oft reported monastic lifestyle was a veneer for patronage and nepotism on top of the other porkies?

Robert said...

Dixie,

Came upon this information earlier tonight and if this rumour is proved correct how ironic this reads:-

'Two famous writers were stationed in Ebrington Barracks during part of the First World War. They were the poet Francis Ledwidge (1887-1916) and the 18th Baron Dunsany, Edward John Moreton Drax Plunkett (1878-1957).

Francis Ledwidge was born in Slane, County Meath and was always writing poetical untutored verses. His local landlord was Lord Dunsany, who was also interested in the Celtic revival. Lord Dunsany joined the Royal Inniskilling Fusilers in 1914 and Francis Ledwidge also joined the same regiment and became a corporal. The regiment was sent to Ebrington Barracks in 1916 after serving in Serbia, Greece and Egypt. Lord Dunsany rented a house near Derry called Government House and he allowed Francis to have a room in it to write his poems. While he was in the barracks he composed some 47 poems including his poem entitled 'Derry'. He was very interested in the 1916 rising and it was Lord Dunsany who prevented him from deserting to join the Rising in Dublin.'

Dixie said...

Very interesting Robert. You seem to know quite a lot about this House. I'm sure I know the one you are talking about now.

In fact I live about a 15 min walk from it.

itsjustmacker said...

Robert:

well done for putting that info up, The name Plunkett crops up a lot of times.

larry hughes said...

Breaking news. Michaelhenry has been handed a wee holiday home for service and blind loyalty to SF. Check it out.

http://www.daft.ie/searchrental.daft?id=1270007

michaelhenry said...

Larry-

Its lucky that wit is a gift else it would cost you a fortune to attain it-

Roberts rumour has gone Quiet-

Dixie said...

Perhaps Robert's rumour has gone quiet because unlike the councillor for Cookstown people don't sit on the internet all day doing nothing else.

Do you know something Mick Henry or McIvor. Adams and company try hard to be accepted but the Unionists can't stomach them, the Politicians in the South can't stomach them and most Republicans can't stomach them.

Marty must've swallowed his own bile when Hume was given a standing ovation at the Sons and Daughters concert.

Oh and don't give me shit about how many vote for them. People vote them because they want peace. The Shinners know this that's why they've taken to calling it 'Our Peace Process' lately.

If those who think that armed struggle will take us somewhere see sense the Shinners will lose votes like a tree loses leaves in the autumn.

itsjustmacker said...

Dixie:

People vote them because they want peace.

people vote for them because no alternative has produced itself , as yet, People think they have peace, because of those massive big PEACE WALLS, they are not sure if they were erected to keep them in or keep others out!

michaelhenry said...

Dixie-

" people dont sit in the internet all day doing nothing else "

I dont know how long it takes you to write a comment but it only took me 5 minute's today to type in mine- there is the whiff of the nazi about you Dixie-they did not like others writing there views either-

itsjustmacker-

" People think they have peace,because of those massive big PEACE WALLS "

Yet there are no Peace walls in South Armagh-East Tyrone or in South Derry but there is Peace-a big wall is just another excuse for some-

itsjustmacker said...

michaelhenry:

"et there are no Peace walls in South Armagh-East Tyrone or in South Derry "

ffs Michael, are you that low on intelligence?.

They are not needed in those areas. duh.

Dixie said...

Says Mick Henry...Amusingly

"I dont know how long it takes you to write a comment but it only took me 5 minute's today to type in mine- there is the whiff of the nazi about you Dixie-they did not like others writing there views either-"

Ah but it takes you an hour to think up something to say...

Mick are you fecking serious in the 2nd part? Nobody gives a fiddlers about your views because we all know you lot can't have views unless Gerry or his censers tell you what your views are first.

You go on holidays with Adams, Gerry gets the rooms with views you get the rooms facing brick walls.

frankie said...

MichaelHenry..

Yet there are no Peace walls in South Armagh-East Tyrone or in South Derry but there is Peace -a big wall is just another excuse for some-

The part I put in bold. What are you trying to say? An excuse for what..keeping communities divided, instilling fear & hatred..

So there wasn't any (hardly any) oxymorons in the places you mentioned. But what about the watch towers in the same areas that had all the the appliance's of science that Zanussi could manufacture? They allowed the BA to look directly into peoples homes or bounce sound waves of windows and listen to private family conversations. Which could explain the lack of them in South Armagh etc..And you are forgetting the biggest oxymoron in the North manned by BA & RUC called the border that directly affected the regions you mentioned.

No offence meant here Michael, but if you are the best SF have to offer in making their case on the TPQ, you aren't doing your party any favours.

AM said...

Michaelhenry,

are you for real? A whiff of the Nazi about Dixie? Your party has intimidated and censored to cower people into withholding their views. You are an exception in being prepared to debate although you seem to have difficulty in articulating your position. Your party hates different ideas. Dixie has always been open to different opinions. He is not picketing houses telling people to shut up or else.

larry hughes said...

'He is not picketing houses telling people to shut up or else.'

SF have a long history of that from Gerry Fitt times. Makes you realise how ugly that wee gang are!

AM said...

Larry,

the thugs came to my house when I was not there and on the second occasion got my wife who was six month's pregnant. That didn't deter them as they howled at her anyway. She faced them down while they all stood there screaming 'who the hell are you? Gerry's lies are true.'!!

michaelhenry said...

Dixie-

Where is Robert with the proof of his story-telling-

AM-

Never supported those thugs protesting at your family-thank God most of them are dissos now-

AM said...

Michaelhenry,

what ones are dissidents? None that I know of. The leader of the gang went on to become a SF councillor.

marty said...

Paddy Devlin was one of the first to be hounded out of his home in Andytown, a socialist with a capital S, tout relatives of the well placed allowed to walk while others got the traditional bullet in the back of the head,and now the whole oragnisation is tainted with the influence of touts,they belittle the "dissidents"because of the tout influx,they should know..q$£ have been anything but an influence for good for the people of these areas.they disgraced themselves when the picketed Tommy Gormans and Anthony Mc Intyres homes.

frankie said...

Michael, piece of advice, learn how to proof read yourself and think about what you say..

Never supported those thugs protesting at your family-thank God most of them are dissos now-

So by your logic, at the time republicans protested outside Anthonys family home and Tommy Gormans they weren't 'dissos'. That means they were from the same party as you represent? And if you do a quick online research, you'll see it was the PRM/SF who are the guilty party (in fact they bused people in<---when you think of how many times they (PRM) have accused anti-GFA republicans of busing in supporters..kettle, pot & black spring readily to mind.)
I hope you understand what I mean..

larry hughes said...

marty

what chance the RUC inserted provo touts into the anti-GFA IRA to destroy them. Closet provos i would suggest, not the other way about.

marty said...

Larry I would say every possibility,and it would, I think be foolish to the extent of stupidity not to a cara.

Belfast Bookworm said...

Michael Henry; 'thank god most of them are dissos now'

What sort of comment is this? My understanding is that the intimidation the McIntyres experienced was organised, led, facilitated and supported by mainstream 'republicans'. It doesn't matter if they're moon men now, it's who sanctioned and drove it when it happened that's the issue.

Your utter stupidity a actually astounds me and yet again I'm remind that a village has lost an idiot somewhere.

Belfast Bookworm said...

Michael Henry; 'there is the whiff of the nazi about you Dixie-they did not like others writing there views either'

If this comment didn't come from a SF councillor it wouldn't be so outrageous. Your party, Michael Henry, has hounded people, in some cases to their deaths, for expressing their views. The tactics of Sinn Fein would make even hardened Stasi cringe.

What f****** planet are you on? You are a joke to anyone with an ounce of intelligence but you are actually a liability to your own party who for the most part, will be face palming at your rants, shaking their heads and searching frantically for someone who will take your seat. You do realise this? You are thick, bucket mouthed, ill informed and thick. (Did I say that already?).... and your days are numbered with them if only you could see it.

I cannot wait to be honest, til you're tossed out on yer ear. Better men and women than you have but the difference with you is that you've made a career out of making a complete and utter fool of yourself and no one in their right mind would want you.

You are a liability. Take heed.

itsjustmacker said...

Michaelhenry:

"DISSO'S"?
Michael,you have to stand up and be counted, and, face the actual facts, They were Provo's at that time, sent by your leader to bombard abuse at Anthony's pregnant wife, also to Anthony. and Tommy Gorman, with his whole family getting verbal abuse.

One of them went on to become an MLA!, lets not forget, Adams/McGuinness/Kelly; all stated they would speak to those you now call "DISSO'S", That should have been done when those who opposed the GFA at the very start instead of sending in the heavy gangs to intimidate people: SF=Ourselves Alone, The SF higher echelon took that literally and said, Fuck you lot, You do it my way, Its one for the money, two for the show, three to get ready, because, here we go, into the big house on the hill, an Ulster unionist (Carsonite) House, British through and through, and There is no way of getting a United Ireland from sitting in that House.

Feel te love said...

Mackers I remember hearing about those protests outside your home. It must have been a very traumatic time for you and your family. Reading the above comments had me wondering,who these people were. I recently heard about a member of SF from the Murph who was sacked from his job just before Christmas after being caught on cctv stealing from the waitresses Christmas tips jar. Was wondering was he one of the picketers, as he fills all the criteria of being a scumbag, SF and a thief. Will send you the name but please not for posting.

larry hughes said...

Belfast bookworm

don't be two hard on michaelhenry. He's willie frazers lost twin, they got seperated in the hospital at birth.

Dixie said...

I would love to hear the debates in Cookstown Council.

Listen at the door and you'd end up believing you were listening in on primary 7s.

"The pot holes on the Upper Hill Road are outrageous what does council intend to do?"

"I believe that Dissos are up there at night training with pipe-bombs. Those aren't pot holes but the craters left by Disso pipe bombs. I utterly condemn this and ask their leaders to explain their actions to the wider community."

Feel te love said...

Mackers any chance there are snaps of those people who tried and failed to intimidate you and your family?. If so, would it be possible for you to upload them here.

Dixie said...

Feel te love, are you serious mo chara or are you being sarcastic?

Why should Mackers stoop to their level?

It happened. We know it has happened. And we know they were nothing but dogs unleashed by their masters.

Why put up photos of fools who barked when ordered to bark?

frankie said...

Bookworm in your rant to St Michael...

What f****** planet are you on? You are a joke to anyone with an ounce of intelligence but you are actually a liability to your own party who for the most part, will be face palming at your rants, shaking their heads and searching frantically for someone who will take your seat. You do realise this? You are thick, bucket mouthed, ill informed and thick. (Did I say that already?)....

I'd like to second that..BTW it made me laugh..

Robert said...

MichaelHenry,

What proof do you require?

Belfast Bookworm said...

Larry; Willie Frazer has nothing on this boy - at least Willie gets its right some of the time - like the horse meat/ira connection!

itsjustmacker said...

feel to love:

"Mackers any chance there are snaps of those people who tried and failed to intimidate you and your family?. If so, would it be possible for you to upload them here."

RUC/PSNI would love to see (if any were available) photographs. ffs, no disrespect to yourself, only an RUC/MI5/Special Branch/PSNI, would ask such a question, but I must state, You have got me wondering now!!!. Why Make such a diabolical Request???????????. think about it, Photos put on TPQ, Same people lifted and interned?, were would that leave Anthony,Carrie and Kids!!!!. duh. Re-read your post please. Probably you might amend it. intelligence !!!!!!!!!!!!.

Feel te love said...

Dixie I was not around at the time of these protests and have absolutely no doubt it happened. Was just trying to get some deeper understanding of this and to see the faces of these people and what they might be at now. Did nt someone say,one of them became an MLA/colaborator. I have had my own problems with these scum and I strongly feel that exposing them at every opportunity is the only way to fight them and marginalise them. You know like the ATown/NBN tries to do with repubicans that disagree with SF.
With regards BMcA,this woman also got involved in the HolyCoss situation at the request of the families. It would be great if she stood in Tyrone, she is of the people and for the people and always has displayed this quality.

Belfast Bookworm said...

Feel te love; 'It would be great if she stood in Tyrone, she is of the people and for the people and always has displayed this quality.'

I'd agree with that. Certainly, I can see SeamusMc's point about republicans taking seats in Westminster, but Bernadette McA went there before, made no bones about it. I don't see the problem, she never said she wouldn't.

It's only a matter of time before Westminster is bursting at the seams with NI MP's anyway.

AM said...

Dixie/Itsjustmacker,

Feel te love's request is simply a call for name and shame. Nothing wrong with that. The RUC flooded the area during the picket. Somebody told me they and the Shinners were flashing headlights at each other each time their vehicles passed. Don't know how true it was. Even if there was only one in ten of those picketing the houses on the Brit payroll it was more than enough for the cops to know who was there.

We don't have any photos of the gang in any event.

AM said...

Feel te Love,

yes, send me the details. It will not be published

michaelhenry said...

Belfast Bookworm-

" your days are numbered with them "

Them is me- I'll be there to the end-and the new start-

Robert-

" What proof do you require "

The proof that you have not got-

Dixie-


" I would love to hear the debates in cookstown council "

Be there- [ the loyalists say they are going to picket there in the near future so you would be in good company ]
There is a free bar upstairs- we can watch the fcuks from there-

















Feel te love said...

Itsjustmackers. I dont believe my request warranted your reaction but you are entitled to hold your view.Sorry that it upset you to the point of insulting me. Thankfully Mackers does not seem to have taken it just as bad as yourself on this occasion.

Belfast Bookworm said...

Michael Henry; what?

You know you make Jamie Bryson sound like James Joyce.

larry hughes said...

michaelhenry

'Be there- [ the loyalists say they are going to picket there in the near future so you would be in good company ]
There is a free bar upstairs- we can watch the fcuks from there-'

as long as yer in the same diplomatic corp as myself...count me in!


AM said...

Feel te love,

thanks a lot

itsjustmacker said...

feel to love:

It was not my intention to insult you, if you think it was, then please accept my apologies , It was a query.

Feel te love said...

Itsjustmackers. hope I was nt coming across as over sensitive.Thanks anyway.

Mackers no problem.

michaelhenry said...

Larry-

I am in the same box- you and dixie and AM and Marty and the rest are welcome any time-but be warned-its only drink whilst we watch the loyalists-cant have those who dont like a pint [ of whiskey ]

Robert said...

MichaelHenry,

The question was put with the surety that your requirement would hardly prove taxing. You did not disappoint.

I have a hunch that if I entered your name into an English to Chinese translator it would read - Sim Pul Twat.

larry hughes said...

michaelhenry

i do love a good comedy and the fleg -show has certainly provided it...pull me a pint i'm on my way over!

frankie said...

Bloody Sunday families offered £50,000 compensation

itsjustmacker said...

Frankie:

That is a blatant insult to all those families, and, to those survivors.

I would say a minimum starting point of £1000,000 would be appropriate. and, those paras brought to justice in the haige.