Sunday, July 1, 2012

Tagged under:

Bitter Medicine the Only Cure

Former Blanket journalist, Dr John Coulter, maintains that it is only through a spiritual awakening that the Irish Catholic Church can have any future meaning among the nationalist working class.

The Irish Catholic Church needs a spiritual rebirth, not institutional tinkering, if it is to have any meaning among Ireland’s working classes. The same debate is taking place in the Protestant community where the loyalist working class largely feels abandoned by the various mainstream Unionist parties.
 
The clerical abuse scandals, allegations of cover-ups and increasing secularism in society have hit both attendances at Mass and confidence in the Catholic hierarchy not just in republican heartlands, but right across the entire island.
 
The scene from the film, The Wind That Shakes The Barley, where the Catholic priest is hearing confessions of IRA members and blessing their cause before they attack the Black and Tans is now merely mythology.
 
One of the most disturbing aspects of the debate on the future direction of the Irish Catholic Church is that many confuse institutionalised ritual with a true Bible-based Christian faith. Many people across Ireland oppose Biblical Christianity because they associate it with the structures, practices and personalities of the Irish Catholic Church and the Vatican itself in Rome. This spiritual rebirth for the Irish Catholic Church should not be dismissed as simply a call for Catholics to become Protestants.
 
Many Irish Catholics have lost confidence in their Church leadership, but not in the concept of a Christian faith. Ironically, the same secularism and materialism is hitting many of the Protestant denominations in Ireland, with them also suffering falls in attendances at Sunday services and mid week Bible studies. There are reports of ordinary Catholics attending Protestants churches, but not joining the denominations. In some cases, Catholic priests have been spat upon in the street in the same way some of the members of the Dublin Easter Rising were spat upon by Catholics as they were marched away into captivity in 1916.
 
The one Christian denomination which seems to be growing is Pentecostalism. A church has even opened on Belfast’s Falls Road in a building once linked to the Workers’ Party. The denomination began in Monaghan in the early 1900s, and now has churches across Ireland. Known for its lively form of worship and strong emphasis on the Salvationist theology, the Irish Catholic hierarchy frequently dismissed Pentecostalism as yet another brand of Protestantism.
 
If the Catholic Church does not implement this spiritual rebirth, it will become nothing more than a meaningless social gathering uttering irrelevant superstitions. Structurally, the Irish Catholic Church must severe its ties with the Vatican. It must become an independent church where the people in the pews have the democratic right to elect their own priests, bishops, archbishops and cardinals.

The Catholic Church has great financial wealth in its convents, chapels, monasteries and cathedrals. In the Biblical New Testament, Jesus Himself advised the rich young ruler to sell all he had and give to the poor if he wanted to follow Christ.

The austerity measures have – and will continue – to cause extreme poverty across Ireland. The Irish Catholic Church must stop sending cash to Rome, sell its Irish possessions and give the profits to help the poor and needy across this island, especially those from the working classes.
  
Doctrinally, the Catholic Church must adopt the spiritual direction of the New Testament text St John Chapter 3, verse 16 and the Words of Jesus: “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.”
  
The Irish Catholic Church must teach the concept of a personal faith in Jesus Christ, not institutionalised ritual and unquestioning loyalty to a former Hitler Youth member in his eighties in Rome.
  
As for the priesthood, holy orders and the sisterhood, celibacy must be made an option of choice. How the Irish Church would be revitalised if it echoed to the sound of young married families and children in the parochial houses with clerics who were elected by the people, working for the people.
 
It is a sorry state of spiritual affairs in Ireland, that this island – which once boasted a large number of Christian missionaries from all denominations being sent to spread the Gospel of Christ abroad – is witnessing the concept of reverse evangelism.
  
This is where those countries, especially in Africa, where in the 19th and 20th centuries Ireland sent missionaries, they are now sending missionaries back to Ireland itself to evangelise the island!
  
However, the spiritual rebirth of the Catholic Church should not be misinterpreted as signalling a revival of the ecumenical movement, where liberals in both the Catholic and some Protestant denominations attempted to use joint worship to agree a common theology.
 
But existing conservative Catholic doctrine and the Reformed Faith have little in common, so in spite of a lot of clever spin, ultimately the ecumenical movement has completely failed.
 
The most successful Irish Christian development which has brought people from Catholic and Protestant traditions together under one spiritual banner has been the Pentecostal movement, not to be confused with American-style tele-evangelism.
 
It has adopted the Old Testament Biblical text as its ethos, Ezekiel Chapter 37, verse 26: “A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you; and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.”
 
The Protestant denominations face the challenge of how they can help the loyalist working class given the great ‘switch off’ among Unionist working class voters.
 
The Catholic Church has a major credibility problem with its working class, many of whom are in danger of becoming lapsed members of the Church.
 
The bottom line is that the Irish Catholic Church must have a spiritual awakening before it can enjoy the benefits of a religious revival.
 
It must become an independent Church of ‘born again’ or Salvationist Christian believers who have institutionally divorced themselves from the Vatican. But time is not on Irish Catholicism’s side.
 
The longer its leadership delays, the fewer people will drift away from Mass, the more the cross-community Biblical Christian Pentecostal movement will gather momentum, and the less relevant the Irish bishops will be in the religious and social life of this island.
 
Bitter medicine this may be, but the hard religious reality is that there is no other solution to save the Irish Catholic Church. Perhaps, the starting point is to ponder the question – if Jesus Christ Himself was here, how would be solve the dilemma the Irish Catholic Church now finds itself immersed in?

92 comments :

John McGirr said...

Much that it is touching to see your concern for the future of the Catholic Church in Ireland, John, it is really not possible for someone who is so unaware of the nature of that Church to be constructive in any meaningful way. We are on different wavelengths.

The very fact that you keep urging it to break from the Vatican shows that you are not even a ‘Biblical Christian’ as you don’t seem to be aware of our Blessed Lord’s words;

“And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. And I will give to thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven. And whatsoever thou shalt bind upon earth, it shall be bound also in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose upon earth, it shall be loosed also in heaven.”

There is NO Catholicism without the Papacy, and Rome is its centre. Ubi Petrus ibi Ecclesia.

I am not denying that the Irish Catholic Church is in crisis, but it is OUR crisis, not yours. So you can keep your Pentecostal version of Protestantism, thank you. Protestantism has splintered into thousands of sects, each contradicting the others, united only in hatred of Christ’s Church and most notably of the See of Peter. In fact the reason the Catholic Church is in crisis is because so many have attempted to Protestantize it; heretics of the ilk of Hans Kung and Joseph Ratzinger to name but two.

truthrevisionist said...

Every lie has within its DNA the seed of its own destruction.Lies replicate,to provide sustenance for greed power and control, and us fools are fed a diet of fear and bread and circuses to make us compliant.The complete package is called religion, and it comes with different wrappers for all occasions,so that when you get sick of one,you can try another,and another....until your heavenly little hearts content.Just,for the sake of god,[oh,and truth] dont look inside or you might find they are all peddled by the same vermin, who give us wars and kill us by the millions, to line their pockets and keep control by dividing us.How can a catholic partake, with the knowledge of sanction and cover up,of henious crimes against innocent little children?How can a jew endorse the paedophile mutilation by a rabbi, of an infant through the religious ceremony of 'metzitzah b'peh'? And the list of 'how can' questions goes on forever,and people fumble and mumble and think and seek and explain and diffuse and excuse....and the liars and vermin get away with it again-and were all happy its fixed,because weve had it repackaged.The only thing is,every time I look at a place of worship now in all forms, I see the endgame.The Truth gene in the DNA has gotten out of the bottle!

AM said...

John & John,

always funny to see two bald men disputing a comb

John McGirr said...

AM,
'always funny to see two bald men disputing a comb'

I think you will find that Hans Kung and Joseph Ratzinger both have full heads of hair, but yes it is funny to see them dispute over a comb neither of them requires.

John McGirr said...

I notice that 'truthrevisionist' has signed up today to reply to this .

Another anonymous poster who sounds oh so familiar, or am I just getting cynical?

AM said...

John,

no idea who truthrevisionist is.

I see your self delusion continues unabated. Nothing like religion for that!

Saint?MaryHedgehog said...

Jihad John It is indoctrinated ones like u who waffle on about love of the Vatican and suchlike that are the curse on Ireland & her people.
RE: 'There is NO Catholicism without the Papacy, and Rome is its centre.'
&
RE: '
I am not denying that the Irish Catholic Church is in crisis, but it is OUR crisis, not yours.'

O plz... pass the puke bowl someone!

RE 'OUR crisis' - lolz that is tragic in itself...Do u think u r some bastion of hope for the next generation of Irish unfortunate enough to be birthed into a cult called Catholicism? Well you ain't - but the boyo's in the global rape cartel love your kind. Cannot see the wood for the trees is you.
watch this and wash your religiousity mouth out as you do. 2July 2012 & that Pell from Hell is still lying thru his teeth:

http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/stories/2012/06/28/3535079.htm

Saint?MaryHedgehog said...

@ JCoulter RE: ‘If the Catholic Church does not implement this spiritual rebirth, it will become nothing more than a meaningless social gathering uttering irrelevant superstitions’

Helloooo anyone home? U basically described Catholicism as it has been and is – ‘become nothing more than a meaningless social gathering uttering irrelevant superstitions’

I have never heard preached the radical words of Jesus in a Catholic church Never... Just dirges of regurgitated ritualistic prayers... No wonder Liberation theology was quashed by the Vatican.. it had meaning and it would ultimately spell the end of the Vatican once the teeming minions realised their power.

RE: ‘The Catholic Church has great financial wealth in its convents, chapels, monasteries and cathedrals.’

The money and properties belong to the common people Give it to us you filthy Vatican bastards. The whole doctrine of Catholicism is so far removed from Jesus teachings it is truly amazing in a horrific way to recognise how stupid humanity can be. Giving money to this evil enterprise and the poor are always the most generous. I am owed a fair chunk of gold from the Vatican but they can cram it up their whatnots as i don’t want blood money or shutup money. The Vatican does not give a stuff about the poor or struggling – all that charity work is just for show AND TO ACCESS vulnerable young flesh in impoverished countries.

RE: if Jesus Christ Himself was here, how would be solve the dilemma the Irish Catholic Church now finds itself immersed in?

Too Easy! He would shout Fire for the Vatican and send drones down on the Unholy See. He would confront the pusridden priests, nuns, bishops and Totally Toxic Sham of a Pope Tear them to shreds with words. He would drag them into trials and put them away in the Big House for life sentences.

He would go down the pub for a pint with the common people and say Rise up and take what is rightfully yours. He would kick John McGirr aka Jihad John in the gonads for being such a loon and say in Latin to him Cop on to yerself. Jesus would ring me up and say get ur arse over to Ireland again I have a vocation for you – you are to smash every single catholic statue in Ireland. I would answer Yes Lord I am ready and willing.

On a serious note For Ireland to move forward the Catholic Church has to go completely just like the Loyalists do too.

AM said...

Not much I can agree with Gilmore on but at least he is doing something for human rights with this one and denying the Neanderthals any leverage. He is not forcing anyone into gay marriage, merely ensuring the reactionaries can’t force them out of having the choice Deputy Prime Minister Eamon Gilmore believes the “time has come” for same-sex marriage

AM said...

SMH,

still laughing at all of this. Any of the higgledy-piggledy preachers reading this will be apoplectic

AM said...

powerful stuff

John McGirr said...

Just wondered what you all think of this?

"... in their relations with women, all men are rapists and that's all they are. They rape us with their eyes, their laws, their codes."

Do you think it is fair, right or proper to accuse ALL men because SOME do wrong?

See if you really are the liberals you think you are: substitute 'priests' for 'men' and 'boys' for 'women', then see if you agree with the above quote.

AM said...

John,

pressure?

John McGirr said...

SMH,

I watched your video. It was unbelievable. It does not however negate the Catholic Faith, but it does show that those who have ruled it since Vatican II have a serious case to answer. I’m not sure that it particularly implicates the Vatican though.

I immediately ‘googled’ the words ‘Salesians Father Fox’ and the first item that came up was this:

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/breaking-news/accused-priest-too-old-for-justice/story-e6frf7jx-1226129374373

According to this article the Salesians want Father Fox to be tried, and he will agree to be, if asked, but the police have rejected their offer of an interview with him, on the grounds of his age.

In fact his superior is quoted as saying:

"Ayers is 85-years-old, incontinent and subject to heart problems and blackouts, his doctors would oppose his transfer to Australia, but I will insist, even if it kills him."

Yet, all in all it is a disgusting portrayal of betrayal, by monsters who appear to have been protected and even shielded from justice.

But it does not negate the Catholic Faith, anymore than the shameful deeds of Adams and McGuinness negate the noble cause for the freedom of the Irish people.

John McGirr said...

SMH said:
'On a serious note For Ireland to move forward the Catholic Church has to go completely just like the Loyalists do too.'

Will there be anybody left?

marty said...

Father Patrick, we need to talk about my son Jimmy in Sunday school"oh Jimmy!I have a good feeling about him""yes and its got to stop now"

AM said...

Article behind Times paywall:

Hallelujah! Why Christian Evangelicalism is on the rise


it states 'As Catholicism falls from favour, many alternative sects are taking advantage'

Replacing one circus with another

marty said...

A priest,a paedophile ,a rapist walk into a bar and he orders a drink....

AM said...

what will the higgledy-piggledy men be doing about this?

marty said...

When I first read how scientists in Cern had discovered the subatomic particle referred to as the god particle,I thought to myself"now we really are on our way to dispelling this god myth once and for all"then I got to thinking how this discovery which points us in the direction of creation can be used and I got this vision of the bearded Shipman double carrying a cross through Ballymurphy,

AM said...

if you like your bullshit to be steaming try this

John McGirr said...

AM,

http://www.businessweek.com/news/2012-07-04/higgs-boson-search-fundamental-for-understanding-matter-q-and-a

Just thought of you when I read this, AM.


‘There are two kinds of atheists. Those who make the most noise, the militant ones, detest God and wage war on Him. They make desperate efforts to get rid of Him. They accept the most unsatisfactory hypotheses the moment these seem to hold out any help of suppressing Him. Rather spontaneous generation than God! It is against all experience. So much the worse: anything rather than God. Such an attitude inspires no confidence. The basis of their unbelief is not an act of reason, but an act of will and of passion. God is their nightmare, their fixed idea. They talk about Him so much that they prevent others from forgetting Him. Moreover, men do not detest what does not exist, and hate implies, just as love does, the existence of what one hates or loves. Every blasphemy includes an act of faith. To say “√©crasons l’infime,” or to say, ”Let us adore Him,” is equally to recognize His existence.’
Pere Suau.

AM said...

Marty,

Professor Higgs is an atheist so you can imagine the incense and holy water tonight as the men in funny hats go back to the book of genesis to see what the talking snake has to say about it all.

John,

seems it is yourself you are trying to convince. That old religion of yours isn't doing too well these days! What next - priests rape boys as Punishment for original sin?

marty said...

Anthony maybe they are making sure their seed is not landing on stony ground....

marty said...

If you like your bullshit,Gawwwwwd almighty Anthony £18.5 million turned into one big joke,how can children with open minds be educated and prepared for a very highly technological future when their wee heads are filled with such crap,those freaks need to be put on show and laughed at,they are beyond pity...

itsjustmacker said...

pmsfl at all this crap, I would like to know how many names pope john has and is blogging under. This is one for you John, if so many people in this world are starving to death, or , dying of thirst, why does the holy catholic church not sell of all its stolen treasures and save those people?.

AM said...

Richard Dawkins: A most popular figure

John McGirr said...

Itsjustmacker?

‘I would like to know how many names pope john has and is blogging under.’

Well, let’s see. As SMH has reminded me, no one is coming to back me up…. Therefore I think it is safe to deduce, ONE. That deduction would be correct. Unless, of course, you think that I am arguing with myself… In which case, maybe I am AM, (although it is God who said “I am who AM), or maybe I am itsjustmacker and this is the post to prove it!

‘This is one for you John, if so many people in this world are starving to death, or , dying of thirst, why does the holy catholic church not sell of all its stolen treasures and save those people?.’

What stolen treasures?

“Mary therefore took a pound of ointment of right spikenard, of great price, and anointed the feet of Jesus, and wiped his feet with her hair; and the house was filled with the odour of the ointment. Then one of his disciples, Judas Iscariot, he that was about to betray him, said: Why was not this ointment sold for three hundred pence, and given to the poor?”
(St John, XII, 3,5).

Then Judas approached the Jews to tout on His God for thirty pieces of silver. His real motive being not love of the poor, but hatred of God.

John McGirr said...

Dawkins the world's most famous atheist, (who, curiously is not certain God does not exist), is not so popular with these God-haters!

http://gawker.com/5818993/richard-dawkins-torn-limb-from-limbby-atheists

AM said...

John,

but as certain as he is that the flying spaghetti monster does not exist.

John McGirr said...

AM,
'but as certain as he is that the flying spaghetti monster does not exist.'

I don't think he would go that far.

"Prof Dawkins said that he was “6.9 out of seven” sure of his beliefs."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/9102740/Richard-Dawkins-I-cant-be-sure-God-does-not-exist.html

6.9 out of 7 does not constitute any form of certainty.

I am 7 out 7 certain that the FSM does not exist, (unless it's just mackers).

Saint?MaryHedgehog said...

@ Anthony JJ itsjustmackers marty etc a song God Told Me To by paul kelly (raised RC) who states he no longer believes in God It just come on me mind when was reading here... One of the most full on statements His anger is palpable. I think he spoke for all the atrocities in the world done in the name of religions.

JohnMc/JJ take note of this song - My name is Jihad John lol he is telling some harsh truths about religiosity...

God Told Me To:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ptzrY7JuG_4&feature=relmfu

AM said...

John,

he has stated openly this is what he believes. He has the same degree of certainty about there being no fairies, goblins, celestial teapots, FSMs and gods. It is not the atheists who persuade me of non existence, it is the believers who do that.

Saint?MaryHedgehog said...

@itsjustmackers RE: '...if so many people in this world are starving to death, or , dying of thirst, why does the holy catholic church not sell of all its stolen treasures and save those people?.'

I am answering it as well tehe
The Vatican will justify by saying they do all these good works in nations worldwide. Now whilst there are individuals who defo do the groundwork all the while thinking the headhonchos in their pointy hats/jewels/robes care... Truth is they don't care. All the dedicated workers are just fodder for the big Money Machine aka Vatican... Another facet is that the poor are necessary for the religious pecking order to remain intact...

So if the Vatican were to give their all in wealth sense to the impoverished it would mean no more Vatican... Money talks and bullshit walks... Another facet to poverty is corrupt politics and such but there can be no valid reason why in the religious facet the Vatican who claims to represent Christianity - hoards wealth whilst people struggle and perish.
Jesus was working class - a carpenter.

marty said...

John even Durex cant guarantee 100%

marty said...

Brill SMH and the video is powerful also.

Saint?MaryHedgehog said...

I must say since reading this blog regularly i have had immense doubts about my belief in God. But i choose to keep believing in Jesus as nothing else matches up even tho I have more questions than answers. Worth noting Anton LeVey freaked out on his deathbed & begged for God's mercy. I figure he saw the world beyond. Quite something for an ardent satanist to renege. And there have been atheists who have reneged whilst living... The worst part of being a christian is I don't like many of them LOL & despise most religous constructs esp the Vatican.

When i worked in terminal care decades ago you see all sectors of society on their way out. The worst death i was present for was a man who died cursing and screaming hate at God -his eyes were like burning coals of hate. So much for me soothing hand on his dying brow number. The nurse with me was atheist but she was TOTALLY freaked out. The hospice room was filled with hate/horror vibes.

I was SO PLEASED when he finally carked it after about an hour of this stuff. Note: this man was lucid & NOT drug affected. I have seen more than a few fucked up dying moments of individuals but that one is embedded in me memory forever. It is easy to dismiss God as myth but it is harder to face into maybe He is just is... It works both ways. Terminal care is the acid test. Go sit in a hospice on a night shift Report back here LOL

AM said...

Marty,

you will only reinforce the anti condom men saying that! Do you remember that fool lying from Rome about them not working and the sperm slips through? He was the president of the Vatican's Pontifical Council for the Family: "The Aids virus is roughly 450 times smaller than the spermatozoon. The spermatozoon can easily pass through the 'net' that is formed by the condom.'

The World Health Organisation responded: "These incorrect statements about condoms and HIV are dangerous when we are facing a global pandemic which has already killed more than 20 million people, and currently affects at least 42 million."

He was ridiculed by the scientific community and scorned beyond.

marty said...

Always wondered why they didnt use them a cara?and here,s me thinking their willies were a no go area,the bastards were to tight to go to Boots for something for the weekend,
SMH That light you see at the end of the tunnel hon .its the headlight of an oncoming train!

AM said...

Marty,

you could just imagine the dour old tossers sitting adjudicating on a priest who wore a condom for child rape. Excommunication for him. No condom and its three Hail Marys and say the first mass when you finish them.

John McGirr said...

SMH,

‘No wonder Liberation theology was quashed by the Vatican.. it had meaning and it would ultimately spell the end of the Vatican once the teeming minions realised their power.’

So what do you think of the new card-carrying heretic, Gerhard Muller, who is to head the CDF?

http://www.remnantnewspaper.com/

This heretic is a devotee of ‘liberation theology’ and he is now in charge of doctrine in the Catholic Church. (Also he does not believe the Blessed Virgin is a virgin, he finds Transubstantiation ‘problematic’, and hates the Latin Mass.

You do know what this means, don’t you? YOU are closer to modern apostate Rome than I am. You, Ratzinger and his new side-kick, Gerhard Muller are closer than you think.

I vomit on modernist, apostate Rome

AM said...

John,

take some of John Coulter's bitter medicine. It should help you with the vomiting

John McGirr said...

Marty,

‘..even Durex cant guarantee 100%’

That is why its use by someone with AIDS is like playing Russian Roulette with a potential victim. Surely any risk of contracting AIDS, even if very low is too high a risk!

AM,

he has stated openly this is what he believes.

And he states openly on the link I provided that he is 6 on a scale of 7 sure that God does not exist. He later amended that to 6.9 out of 7. I don’t know if you do the lotto, but if you had a 1 out of 7 or 0.1 out 7 chance of winning, I think you would regard them as pretty good odds. And that from the ‘world’s leading atheist.’

‘It is not the atheists who persuade me of non existence, it is the believers who do that.’

That is not logical. There is no logical connection between the existence or not of God and your impression of Theists.

‘He was ridiculed by the scientific community and scorned beyond.’

His Master was scourged, spat on and crucified by the Jewish God-haters of His day.

AM said...

John,

His Master was scourged, spat on and crucified by the Jewish God-haters of His day.

Dracula?

John McGirr said...

AM,

"His Master was scourged, spat on and crucified by the Jewish God-haters of His day.”

‘Dracula?’

???

He is the incarnate Son of God, and redeemer of mankind. He is the One we measure all history in relation to whether it happened before His Advent, or after it.

AM said...

Praise the Lord John, Praise the Lord.

Saint?MaryHedgehog said...

@JJohnMcG I did look at that link
http://www.remnantnewspaper.com/
& briefly cast me jaded eyes over the waffle and so on. Look whatever the CDF does is no new shock & awe number. Their fecal laden synapses fire off a trillion twisted thoughts Ah! ponder their esoteric knowledge NOT!
They be so far removed from reality or any authentic belief/faith that nothing they do raises me eyebrows. I mean is not the Vatican the one who whilst opposing abortion allowed millions to be infected with hiv/aids as pointed out here by others & is not the Vatican the one who expects the minions to adore their hierarchy.

Is not the Vatican the one who spawned a global rape cartel & still protects the perps. Does it not do standovers on victims & blockades justice?. It is all so vile it beggars belief...
Is so far off the air, so devoid of grounded real belief in God it is just a toxic stew with a sprinkle of pseudo spirituality on top. People gobbled up this stew as they were generationally worn down, generations of indoctrination... But it is true that worldwide once staunch Catholics are leaving in droves.

The reality of being duped has crashed in on them. It is abit difficult to continue to trust a religious construct that is daily in the media with more revelations of their abominations...

Walk away from the crap Jihad John. You engage in defending the indefensible – God is simply a tool for the Vatican to use. Re Liberation Theology, The Communist Manifesto etc All great theories but if put into the hands of maniacs devastation ensues. Liberation theology coming into Catholicism was the recognition of the corruptness of the Vatican – it angled at misogyny, patriarchy, induced poverty by the withholding of monetary assistance ( who wears Gucci shoes, jewels, robes & sits in a big chair with a pointy hat on his poxed wee head? satan does love his toys & roars of approval from the deceived!)

These bastards need to get real jobs & live in the real gritty world of reality. U know the one where u work your arse off, pay bills...

Catholicism has failed the people because it is NOT grounded in authentic spiritual belief but definitely grounded in domination & manipulation. I have no idea why you or Anthony read the crap so called theologians write. It is a waste of time imo. You have to walk your own path with the God stuff. Basically we are all alone with that number – no-one can do your thinking for you. U gotta do it and make conclusions/decisions that way.

We come into this world alone & naked & we will exit the same way essentially. PS ‘Men’s knowledge is fools wisdom’ – Bible. Think JJ think.

John McGirr said...

SMH,

You continue to confuse the ‘Vatican’ as it has been from John XXIII onwards as if it is the same ‘Vatican’ that existed prior to the death of Pius XII. The current ‘Vatican’ has defected from the Catholic Faith and the scandals, (though a lot less than in the rest of the population), are but a symptom of their defection.

I would compare it to the defection of PSF in 1986 when they renounced traditional Republicanism. It would be ridiculous to say that Republicanism is wrong because traitors recognized Leinster House, cut a dirty deal, went in to Stormont and have used the Movement to enrich themselves and improve their property portfolios.

That is not to deny that there were earlier traitors, sometimes a few, sometimes many, but the Second Vatican Council was for the Catholic Church what 1986 was to the Republican Movement. Gerry Adams, Martin McGuinness et al. have renounced the Republican Faith. Roncalli, Montini, (probably Luciani), Wojtyla and Ratzinger have renounced the Catholic Faith. There are still a few in both, caught up in the trappings who have not yet realised this.

The difference with the Catholic Church though, is we have Christ’s Word that He will never abandon His Church, and though it is now dispersed it will never be destroyed. This is not to make it invisible, as Christ founded a visible Church, but it is less visible due to treachery within. To a large extent the position now could be seen as it was in England after Anglicanism was established and most of the country switched religions without realizing it. Almost the entire hierarchy defected in England and as a result a nation was lost to the Faith.

Modernist ‘Rome,’ unlike the ‘Eternal Catholic Rome,’ is protestant, it has rejected the Catholic Faith. Ergo its abuse scandals are in your camp, not mine.

marty said...

SMH "The world where you work your arse of" they have a better time with arses than working hon...

AM said...

Marty,

on the subject of arses

marty said...

The only advice that I could give kids in America after reading that Anthony is ,emigrate,be afraid very afraid,always walk in reverse,if you drop something ffs kick it home before bending down to pick it up..

Ryan said...

Hey Hey guys at least we put our paedo priests away in prison. YOur bishop his eminence Cardinal Brady is still in power calling the shots when he should be wasting away in Portlaoise Prison. Why is Ireland so "fu#$%^d up?

AM said...

Ryan,

and fucked right up the priestly

Saint?MaryHedgehog said...

@marty "The world where you work your arse of" they have a better time with arses than working hon...'
yes Vatican ArseVille! lolz it sickens me how the PERVERTED men of the cloth are supported by donations. Here's abit of craic an Aboriginal elder JJ told me about a much loved by Aboriginal Australia Irish activist priest over here (Fr Ted of Redfern - died ages ago)

When he was a kid JJ continually stole money from Fr Teds collection box. Fr Ted used the church as a refuge for all Aboriginal kids, families, homeless, alcoholics etc Anyway at Christmas Fr Ted gave each Aboriginal kid a fair whack of money as a present from the church donations. But when JJ come up to Fr Ted with his hand out for his $$ Fr Ted said: "FUCK OFF! you have had your share all through the year"
LOL i larfed me guts out when he told about it.

@JJMcGirr i just cannot abide the fuckery your reasonings are at times & that arrogance you project. That numbed religosity is tedious.

Saint?MaryHedgehog said...

@Ryan 'Why is Ireland so "fu#$%^d up?'
the mixture of church & state is a start towards recognising why & then centuries of subjugation...
She has imploded on it all has our Ireland but will rise up stronger. This is just the outworkings... the pus of the wounds is flowing out...

marty said...

Ryan I agree with SMH like any cancer once is gets a hold and if not treated,such as the power of the church and the paedo rings within,then the body stands little chance of survival,

AM said...

Peace campaigner John Hume is knighted by Pope Benedict

AM said...

If John McGirr shouts 'traitor' to the above we won't know if he is referring to the pope or John Hume!

Robert said...

John McGirr,

'Roncalli, Montini, (probably Luciani), Wojtyla and Ratzinger have renounced the Catholic Faith.'

But in an earlier post elsewhere you informed us that these dudes were in possession of the keys to the kingdom of heaven as per your interpretation of Matthew 16: v18-19. Apostates with 'key holder' status?

'Modernist ‘Rome,’ unlike the ‘Eternal Catholic Rome,’ is protestant, it has rejected the Catholic Faith. Ergo its abuse scandals are in your camp, not mine.'

This just gets worse John! Prods with the keys to the kingdom of heaven!

John McGirr said...

Robert,

‘'Roncalli, Montini, (probably Luciani), Wojtyla and Ratzinger have renounced the Catholic Faith.'’

‘But in an earlier post elsewhere you informed us that these dudes were in possession of the keys to the kingdom of heaven as per your interpretation of Matthew 16: v18-19. Apostates with 'key holder' status?’

I said the papacy is in possession of those keys. I never mentioned these particular claimants.

There are three possible views. Firstly, they became heretics and therefore lost the papacy. Secondly, they are bad popes who should be resisted when they act against the Faith. Thirdly, they are ‘material’ popes, but not ‘formal popes.’ This third is close to the first, but it at least means that Benedict XVI is a pope ‘in potency,’ should he ever renounce his errors and re-join the Catholic Church.

‘'Modernist ‘Rome,’ unlike the ‘Eternal Catholic Rome,’ is protestant, it has rejected the Catholic Faith. Ergo its abuse scandals are in your camp, not mine.'’

‘This just gets worse John! Prods with the keys to the kingdom of heaven!’

Not a chance! The keys are well and truly locked away while we are under ‘occupation.’

Robert said...

John McGirr,

Your boiler's busted!

John McGirr said...

Robert,

Do you think that Josef Ratzinger holds the keys to the Kingdom of Heaven then?

John McGirr said...

Robert,

A Prayer For Protestants

May God be kind to captive fish
Who dwell in little bowls and wish
To swim, and can’t, and have no notion
Of what has happened to the ocean.

And may He Bless in aviaries
Continually caged canaries,
Who wonder, when they try to fly,
What can have happened to the sky.

Fr. Leonard Feeney S.J.

Robert said...

John,

'Do you think that Josef Ratzinger holds the keys to the Kingdom of Heaven then?'

I doubt if Ratzinger has the key to his front door!

marty said...

JJ a prayer for the faithful....
Incey wincey spider sitting on a wall.
You think your smart,
You know fuck all.
Your sitting on a wall thats just been plastered.
Now your stuck you stupid bast#@d...

AM said...

Robert,

you are not suggesting that Joey the Rat is a backdoor man are you?!

John McGirr said...

Marty,

http://www.traditioninaction.org/
RevolutionPhotos/A397rPrettyBoys.html

Robert said...

Anthony,

'you are not suggesting that Joey the Rat is a backdoor man are you?!'

Lol. He maybe influenced by a Napoleonic approach -
“We often get in quicker by the back door than by the front”

marty said...

Robert if they were in a bunch would it be grape,,,

John McGirr said...

AM,

Just to clarify, my last post was addressed to your comments rather than Marty.
http://www.traditioninaction.org/
RevolutionPhotos/A397rPrettyBoys.html

AM said...

SMH,

God told me to! Brilliant.

'Not answerable to them or you'

Just about sums many of them up.

Ryan said...

SMH,
I agree Erin will rise up stronger. Hopefully we will one day see a secular 32 county state with a strong economy and where her sons and daughters have no need to emigrate.

AM said...

Allah killed her because he loved her. All praise to no god but one god

AM said...

One of my favourite actresses. good for Ashley Judd

Saint?MaryHedgehog said...

@ Ryan a secular 32... yes secular in that ones personal conviction spiritually do not dictate on to all institutions a hold like the Vatican has. Secular societies can morph into oppressive ones just as toxic as church & state ones.

There has to be universal liberty... Ireland is a primary example of church & state corruption seething under a romanticised skin of 'saints & scholars' NB 'Romantic Ireland's DEAD & gone It's with OLeary in the grave' - wb yeats.

AM said...

SMH,

‘I have no idea why you or Anthony read the crap so called theologians write.’

Neither do I!! I read very little of it these days. The dung that they can actually make up and try to pass off to the sheep serious. I think Hans Kung was the last I read and before that crazed Frank Sheed. That was bunkum if ever you read it and dished out by the shovel full. I like Kung because he avoids the rubbish while holding onto his beliefs. And as usual they tried to censor him.

‘Anton LeVey freaked out on his deathbed & begged for God's mercy.’

His religion makes as much sense to me as any other but I have my suspicions that the evidence for his conversion is along the lines of Lady Hope when she lied about Darwin. It was justification for her own path as distinct from an accurate account of his.

‘And there have been atheists who have reneged whilst living ...’

Do you know any that reneged when they were dead? !!

‘When i worked in terminal care decades ago you see all sectors of society on their way out.’

That was riveting what you described there.

Saint?MaryHedgehog said...

Some good news re William Lynch sexually abused as minor by priest. The 'jury has acquitted a San Francisco man accused of beating a priest at the Los Gatos Sacred Heart Jesuit Center in May 2010.'
http://losgatos.patch.com/articles/jury-acquits-william-lynch

Whilst I don't condone violence against perps i surely understand it... Lynch got a whopping compensation payout for the abuse in the past but like i always say... money ain't gonna heal u. The priest raped both him & his brother. Lynch (now 44 years old) tracked down the priest to a retirement sorta place & busted him up. The child in him finally got revenge one could say.

Saint?MaryHedgehog said...

lolz Re ‘And there have been atheists who have reneged whilst living ...’

AM Do you know any that reneged when they were dead? !!

Nope unfortunately once one goes outta the blue into the black there ain't no coming back. Only Jesus came back!

Saint?MaryHedgehog said...

@ JJMcGirr Am i Catholic enough for you now. Me stuffed into me holy communion dress. The same year a priest tried to force me to get into a car with him Ah the beauty of catholicism & all those tender memories (NOT)Use yer google & goggle at this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arqDZ2JYxRs

I note u have become quite a celeb in here tehe! I am not sure whether to laugh or make a caustic comment so shall say nothin!

AM said...

Saint?MaryHedgehog

I don't agree with them being beaten or attacked. But it is hard to work up any outrage about it. Can just about get it out formally that it is wrong. It is the human in us

John McGirr said...

SMH,

‘Use yer google & goggle at this'

I am not sure what Mother Angelica has done or why you would imply that she abuses children.

You have obviously suffered in some way, but lashing out at the ‘Vatican’ or Mother Angelica is pointless. What is the Vatican? Whoever is to blame for what happened to you is certainly not the Vatican nor Mother Angelica.

As for Nazi slurs on Ratzinger that is plainly ridiculous. He is the most pro-Jewish ‘Pope’ who has ever lived, who spends his life hobnobbing from one synagogue to the next. Maybe he feels guilty at having been forced, in his youth, to have been conscripted into a Nazi boy-scout group that was mandatory in Hitler’s Germany.

(Strange how some can see good in the Orange Order, the KKK, but not the Catholic Church.)

Saint?MaryHedgehog said...

JJMcGirr Re Mother (lolz) Angelica I have not a clue about her but used the footage due to the garb on nuns being like that when i was 7 years old. Also title to left of footage ‘the carrying of the cross’ Groan! All that Catholicised martyrdom pseudo sanctity... Carrying of the cross my arse! Thousands of us kids carried that cross & it was put on us by corrupt Catholicism. I can do and say what I want, how i want, when i want & there ain’t nothing the Pope, his cohorts, Catholicism or outraged Catholics etc can do about it. Lolz yeehaaaaaaaaaaa!

The truth has surfaced worldwide so don’t kid urself JJ that it ain’t gonna get worse - more filth will emerge because the dam has broken & the world sees just what is really going & has been going on forever & a day.

I admit to a somewhat juvenile glee in speaking out but hell I lived with the fallout for decades... I understand why William lynch did what he did only too well. My loathing extends also to the Masonic filth & the pig ignorant porch masons aka nobody OO’s marching to a drumbeat of hate & delusions. The young idiots indocrinated with tales of their forefathers 'glory'. Both Catholicism & OO are stains on Ireland & need to be removed.

Whilst Anthony talks about encountering a decent non bigoted OO in one of his comments & u perceive urself as a decent Catholic no doubt- it is meaningless waffle to me. If any person wants to remain within a corrupt organisation they are simply gutless idiots sheltering inside an identity because they cannot hack facing into truth.

RE ‘You have obviously suffered in some way, but lashing out at the ‘Vatican’ etc... How patronising... All human beings suffer one way or another. Suffering is part of being alive & human...but what child asks to be decimated by so called representatives of God? It is just pathetic when anyone says what u did.

I consider meself extremely fortunate compared to other victims because I had a Dad who set me the example/taught me to fight on & never give up. Just a pity he was such an ardent Catholic but i saw firsthand what the Masonic f..ks did on him & so i guess he sought solace in his religion.

Benny the Rat is about as evil as u can get a Pope. Either u r truly lost in deception of a major kind or u r just blinkered by choice & have some non reality romanticised notion of Catholicism as being Republicanism. I also note how u consistently refer to 'prods' Listen u great git... The planters came & stayed & yes they decimated Irelands native people of which we are her descendants. But this does not mean we keep the hate alive by constantly splintering up sectors of society with devisive labels. In effect u keep hate alive when u do this.

RE: ‘ (Strange how some can see good in the Orange Order, the KKK, but not the Catholic Church.)’

No idea what u r saying here Just more deflective waffle u r so skilled at putting out there. I do not hate Catholics per se but hate their weak idiotic arguments in defence of the Babylon Whore. I spit on the kkk & the Vatican & on Masonic constructs. PS I did have a chuckle that u read that site remmantofgod. U should check out what they have to say on Catholicism/Vatican. te he! PS
re what Coulter wrote - tis truth!
'The Irish Catholic Church must teach the concept of a personal faith in Jesus Christ, not institutionalised ritual and unquestioning loyalty to a former Hitler Youth member in his eighties in Rome.'
Plough on John pushing shit up hill lolz byeeeeee

John McGirr said...

SMHeretic,

You can slander and puke out your hatred of the ‘whore of Bablylon’ to your heart’s content. I have heard it all before. It is a daily occurrence here. You just sound like yet another raving anti-Catholic Prod. We have more than enough up here. You might think you are different, but I don’t see how you are. I have a namesake who is a Presbyterian minister, and all his forefather did was ‘take the soup’. How will your descendants ever realise that your hatred of the Catholic Church is any different to that of Ian Paisley. You are definitely ‘singing from the same hymn shite’. Martin Luther, John Calvin, Jack Chick, Ian Paisley, SMHeretic, all raging against a figment of their protestant imagination, the ‘whore of Babylon’. Your biblical exegesis has not got past level one of a heretic’s guide to anti-Catholic quotes. You are rehashing the discredited garbage of 400 years ago. I imagine you would be pleased to have seen your friends up here a few days ago, burning a statue of the Blessed Virgin holding a tricolour.

AM said...

John,

and this used to be a quiet blog until your hornet's nest was poked!!

AM said...

John,

sort of disappointed you didn't put me in with Jack Chick and the gang!

John McGirr said...

AM,
'sort of disappointed you didn't put me in with Jack Chick and the gang!'

Unlike those listed, AM, I don't think you could care less who the 'whore of Babylon' is!

John said...

John Coulter is a sectarian bigot & a loyalist who should not be allowed to post his views on here.It's funny how traditional Republicans are ridiculed but loyalists are given their own column to espouse their hateful views.

AM said...

John,

we allow you to publish your views. We don't operate Section 31 here

John McGirr said...

AM,

'and this used to be a quiet blog until your hornet's nest was poked!!'

This is getting complicated with all the Johns!

Robert said...

John,

'It's funny how traditional Republicans are ridiculed but loyalists are given their own column to espouse their hateful views.'

That will be 'The Pensive Prod' I guess?

John McGirr said...

Robert,

'That will be 'The Pensive Prod' I guess?'

So you must be the 'Wistful Wasp' then, Robert!

AM said...

"Bitter Medicine the Only
Cure":
John,

‘Strange how some can see good in the Orange Order, the KKK, but not the Catholic Church.’

Or good in the Catholic Church but not in the gay community.

It would be hard to find an institution that has not some good in it. It does not follow that it is a good institution.